"The local Paper" is upset that they didn't get an engraved invitation to meetings!
Once again the editor of the "local paper?" is up in arms that they were not personally notified of meeting dates in Crestwood! Why, he Even went so far as to invoke the name of a past City administrator (now deceased,) who would always let them know of meetings.
Is it me, or is it the job of a "newspaper editor" to do a bit of leg work to find out when a meeting is scheduled? My goodness Even a "one eyed old fat man" who writes a blog here in town knows when the meetings are! How you say, well I look on the Crestwood web site, that's how.
Mr. editor, take your self absorbed liberal bent somewhere else, were all stocked up here in Crestwood, and believe it or not, we couldn't care less how you feel about not being "invited!"
Tom Ford
NO. 347
Is it me, or is it the job of a "newspaper editor" to do a bit of leg work to find out when a meeting is scheduled? My goodness Even a "one eyed old fat man" who writes a blog here in town knows when the meetings are! How you say, well I look on the Crestwood web site, that's how.
Mr. editor, take your self absorbed liberal bent somewhere else, were all stocked up here in Crestwood, and believe it or not, we couldn't care less how you feel about not being "invited!"
Tom Ford
NO. 347
posted by Crestwood Independent at 19:52
55 Comments:
It is just you Tom. Read the story again. The law says they have to be notified. Cant dispute the law. Unbeliavably, you have. If the paper cant be notified on a meeting, then they cant cover it. And who suffers? Not just the paper but the people that cant read it. You dont want the people to suffer do you? This needs to be corrected.
I agree meetings should be made public but it is the papers responsibility to contact the city and let them know they want to be advised. Otherwise who does the city send it to? The Post, Suncrest, Times, Riverfront Times, New York Times, USA Today, Wall Street Journal? Let's use some common sense here. The city has a fax machine with an address directory. Simply assign a secretary at city hall to fax all meeting notices to those papers who request it. End of problem.
I read in the story that the CALL did make that request and was told no.
Yes the papers should work to find out when meetings are going on even if the city doesn't tell them. That's their job. But in this case, it seems to me that there was a deliberate effort on the city's part to not comply with the paper's request. And how is a paper to know of a special meeting? After reading this week's Suncrest Call, I came to 2 conclusions. The first being that the law requires the city to make the paper aware of meetings. If the paper was not aware, especially after requesting those faxes, then that is the fault of the city. And the second observation is that the city has to remedy this situation. The paper has identified the problem and has done what it can do to get these faxes. Now it's up to the city to hold up to their end of the bargain.
so your support of this mayor is such that you are willing to look the other way when it comes to obeying the law? I thought you were a sworn officer of the law?
Real question is what is the mayor and his administration trying to hide from us? More failures of the mayor?
I agree with the other posts, the City not only dropped the ball, but it sure looks like they are hiding something. The Call made the appropriate requests and the City's lack of professionalism is embarassing to the residents.
When a newspaper editor is telling us that there is a decline in the City's relationship with the press, we need to sit up and take notice. This probably means the City's relationship is declining with every other entity it that has business with the City.
My guess is the press release the City auditors gave to the press of a yr ending balance of over $6,000,000 in the black was a lie and the meeting the City didnt want the paper to report on would have disclosed same. First Roy shut down the City forum on the City website preventing citizens from asking questions of the officals and elected people who run our city. Then he moved the Ways and Means meetings to during the work day from Saturdays when most of us who work could attend to were most of us couldnt attend. Then he pushed through the changes in the Civil Service Code preventing a worker of the City talking to the media. So much for wistle blower. Now this! How much more of this behaviour does he think we wlll take before we join Tom Ford at the doors of city hall with our tourchs? Opps sorry, Tom is ok with all of these, and is that true, Tom USED to be an officer of the law? I guess it's what law Tom is talikng about.
RECALL THE MAYOR, NOW!!!
It is not a matter of an "engraved invitation" it is a matter of Crestwood and it's leaders obeying the law of the state of Missouri. The CALL is not requesting any special treatment and in fact is asking the city to do what it could do for any paper, or any person for that matter.
If the Mayor can use reverse 911 to call every citizen in the city about the birthday bash it stands to reason if they wanted to obey the State law they could.
Why dont they want the papers to report what goes on at the meetings?
Well so much for freedom of the press and open access to our local government with this bunch. Who they going to blame now?
I guess they think what we dont know wont hurt us.
This is a violation of the LAW, but to most of the readers of this blog, that's ok because after all it is their man in charge and they trust him.
Hay Tom, better post something about the Swim Club or TDH, looks like your guy has stepped into the brown stuff again and you need to get the focus off his law breaking administration.
The press is the eyes and ears of the public. Without them, we wouldn't know what's going on. And our mayor and aldermen would not be able to spread their message to the entire city. To deny the press is to deny the public of their right to know. Sounds like the folks at city hall have underestimated that right. Why? I have no idea. I sincerely hope this problem is corrected and the press that we depend on is able to do their job not for their sake but for ours as voting residents that have a right to know. The press should be welcomed and encouraged and able to have requests fulfilled. Not shooed away, discouraged and told NO.Doing that doesn't protect the public's best interest. It only protects the interest of those in charge. Sad sad day for Crestwood. Is this what it's really come to?
I will tell all of you that I will never support a person or entity that would not allow our access to what should be public meetings!
That said however how can we really be sure that the "paper" did what they said they did? Did they fax it to Crestwood? Did they call? is there a "record of this at the paper?"
Sorry, I guess it's my background, but I would like to see their records before I condem the City!
As long as the "paper" had a good working relationship with the Mayor, the C/A, and the BOA, all was well. However since the last crew moved on, things have not been so rosey!
Please get outside the box and think about who might be "sand bagging" whom here.
Believe me if I find any "stone walling" buy our guy's, I will be all over them, but let's see just what's going on first.
Tom Ford
Sorry Tom, you are no longer a person any one can trust when comes to matters like this. You have drunk the Mayor's kool aid so much you cant see his lies but only can wait to be told what to think is the truth.
What you are waiting for, the Mayor to come up with his SPIN story on what really happened? Who has the most to lose if proven to be telling a lie, a mayor or the paper? Why the paper does of course so why would they lie when they could lose the trust of their readership and the advertisers that pay for the paper? For the mayor it would just be another misunderstanding and he would sweep it under his carpet.
No the City has really closed it's doors that were so open in the past since Roy got in office, like another poster has already said. Makes me wonder why they dont want the people to know what is going on, what are they hiding, what are they really doing.
So Tom, when and where does your march on "our boys" start? Or are you just going to follow the line of city hall and not think out side the box like you ask those of us who are appalled with this? I dont blame you for leaving P&Z, I wouldnt want my name attached to this group either!
P.S. why didnt you wait to find out the facts like you are asking us to before you wrote your post?
What's new? The Call is LAZY. What a joke!
What do you expect? Hey gave Robertson "Sunshine" award.
Didn't bother to do some real investigating to find out why JIMBO resigned in the middle of the night after attending a certain Holiday Party.
Didn't bother to find out about certain obsence payments to lawyer budies of the former CA\Police Chief.
Didn't bother to find out why the infamous "Forensic Aduit" was not prepared by the Auditing Company that the City spent mucho $$$ on.
Didn't bother to find out how the former Finance Queen spent $100,000+ on an accounting software that couldn't count.
Like I said, LAZY!
So since the Times, Journal, Post Dispatch or RFT didnt report any of the "stories" poster 10:02 listed, I guess they are also lazy?
Fact is if there was a story to cover it would have been done so by one or more of the papers in the area. Since none did, there must not have been a story worth reporting.
All the "local" paper is asking is to be advised of when the City has a meeting so they can cover it, all of this is per State Law. What is the City hiding from the press and therefore us?
Anyone paying attention in Crestwood knows that the CALL is the paper of record. May not agree with their opinions and views all the time. But ask yourself which paper covers Crestwood the most thoroughly. It's the CALL. So if theyre lazy, what does that say about the other papers? No paper will ever cover everything that anybody wants. But for the bulk of work they do, the CALL hands down is the most accurate and the most well researched. No wonder the city wants to stifle them. They know too much!!
The CALL is also the only paper Tom ever comments to on this blog. What does that say about the others? Tom may not realize it, but every time he whines about their "liberal" slant, he pushes more people to read it! He does them a favor! Tom if you really hate the CALL, then stop doing them favors!
The City web site forum was closed before Roy got here. The City had to get rid of their full time web person.
The City pays a good salary for a clerk to do these tasks.
9:02 AM blogger: I do realize it my friend, but I want people to read it just as I want at least one liberal left in the world!
Why you say? Well, I want people to never forget the way these folks talk and act, as well as the "do nothing, touchy feeley actions they believe in!"
I, like Simon Weisenthal believe that the world should never forget the grief and the problems they have wrought upon the country (and any country,) with their idiot ideas, and "feel good" approach to real problems!
Tom Ford
If the Call was truly sincere about its indignation over this issue, then why did it wait a full six (!!)months before reporting it?
The redundant article/editorial quoted an interpretation of the "Sunshine Law" by Jay Nixon that was 14 years old. With matters concerning communication, rapid changes in technology leave many of these interpretations as obsolete as the forms of communication on which they were originally based.
All the city needs to do to comply with the request for notification is email the Call a link to the City's website, where meeting times and dates are posted.
Martha Duchild
Dear Ms. Duchild,
The CALL didnt say they havent gotten any notification since January, what the CALL said is they in January requested notification. This after finding out that the committee you served on the Civil Service Board met 16 times in 2006 without in many cases notice of meetings. Thats not even talking about the lack of minutes for the meeting being made availble for the public and the media to read so we would could find out what you were doing behind closed doors for all those meetings.
If the quote of Jay Nixon's is 14 years too old, do you have a new one that address the issue? You were one who said the City Charter which was 5 years old was fine and needed no changes, kind of talking out of both sides of your mouth, me thinks.
How do you address the refusal of the CIty to allow the tapes of the meetings to be reviewed? What excuse do you have for that?
You are right about one thing, a simple email is all that the City has to do, but if its so simple what are they hiding from us that they dont send it?
Correction: The Charter is ten years old. I'm not sure if the Charter Review Committee's minutes were posted in a timely manner either. The voters wisely said no to most of the strange proposals.
To 3:20 June 30th
Again, if the Call made a request in January, why are they complaining about it in June? Either they had not received notification of all meetings since they first made their request in January, or they have received it. Regardless, six months is a long time to wait to report a story that the Call claims dates back to January.
As for the Charter, it was slightly less than 10 years old at the time changes were being contemplated. I never said it was fine the way it was. I always maintained that it needed updates, but not all of those that were being suggested.
The Civil Service Board requested minutes for our meetings, and they were provided when the city was able to update the city's website to add the Civil Service Board under the "Agendas/Minutes" section of the website. In addition, the city administrator commented at a regular session of the BOA that we had started our work, and provided updates to the aldermen as well, so the idea that the Civil Service Board meetings were done "behind closed doors" is preposterous. Anyone interested in our discussions could have obtained the tapes from city hall since it was public knowledge that our meetings had begun.
It's not my responsibility to come up with a more recent interpretation of the law - the Call chose to pursue this story, not me. How disappointing that they wasted space on a redundant article when they could have celebrated the city's 60th anniversary, as the Times did.
I have no idea what tapes the city refused to allow you to listen to, since your comment is vague. If this was a problem, why didn't you complain at a board meeting?
I don't know who the "us" is to whom you refer in your last sentence, but I'll bet if you called the city and asked them to send you a link to their website, they'd do it.
Martha Duchild
This policy was "cleared" by the city attorney, Rob Golterman - "...City Clerk Tina Flowers had "cleared" that policy with City Attorney Robert Golterman..." Maybe you and Anthony should contact him instead of blaming the mayor.
I'm told by one of my aldermen that the city did NOT refuse to let the reporters of the Call listen to the tapes. Apparently the city clerk has documented proof (copy of an email conversation between herself and Mr. Wasson). Mr. Wasson's "tough schedule" is to blame as to why he didn't make it in to city hall to listen to those tapes. He even thanked the gal for bending over backwards trying to help him out. Why the Call chose to outright lie is beyond me. I wonder what else they're lying about?
Why doesn't everyone who thinks the city is hiding something check out the website? Or request to read the minutes? It's all public record! That supposed "secret" meeting was about the employees health insurance. I saw the meeting notice on the website, but was not able to attend. I knew about the meeting, I CHECKED THE WEBSITE! The Sunshine Law says a city has to make available to the public and media the same information it makes available to the board members. THIS IS WHAT THE CITY DOES! They post the meeting notices on the website and bulletin board for EVERYONE to see. If they DIDN'T post, THEN there would be a violation of the law. So far, nothing illegal has been done. Also, I check the city website on a daily basis (I know...I need to get a life!) and I bet I see those meeting notices before my own aldermen! Let's not point fingers until we get all the facts, folks!
1:39 / 1:48 PM bloggers: Extremey well said my friends, but now what are the "Roy haters" going to do for a complaint?
Let's see, the City is back in the black, no that won't work. We have more businesses coming into Crestwood, no, not that one either.
I know, how about we need new ploice cars, oop's not that one either! Well, darn I guess they have just about run out of gripes.
I guess they will just have to go to their club and brood, poor things! Imagine, no scandal at City Hall, well I guess you can always get on "the paper" and it's tag team editorial staff for reporting the ???
Tom Ford
Dear Martha,
If you had really read the editorial in the Call you would know what tapes the poster was talking about.
Poster 1:39, how do we know your not lying or that your Alderman didnt lie to you? Where is your written proof?
to Poster 3:26: Documented proof means just that...DOCUMENTED PROOF! Also means a hard copied print off of the conversation. I believe my alderman, as he would have absolutely nothing to gain by lying. The lie would catch up just like those of the Call. I was also told that the reporter called to "smooth the feathers" with city staff after the article was written. Why would someone do that if they firmly believe the city is in the wrong? I bet the reporter forgot to check the website, missed a meeting, got chewed out by his superiors and used the city's "alleged law breaking" to cover his rear. There's always gotta be someone at fault and this guy doesn't wanna take the heat. Now, I know the city has had some really serious problems, and I will hold them sternly accountable when wrong doing is evident. However, this time, the city is free and clear. Check the laws. We need to focus on the future and let the past be just that...the PAST. Don't you want to have good government? If you really cared about the happenings of the city, you'd haul your rears to the meetings and find out for yourselves what's going on instead of reading a rag like the Call.
Attention time and money wasters: can we get our streets repaired? Parks properly maintained?
The Call and Board of Alderman can't even address the most basic needs of the City.
Let's address some of the issues we have before dreaming up new ways to spend money we don't have.
Well said!
The paper has no reason to lie. If the reporter had lied, don't you think his boss would know about it by now? I smell a desperate attempt by the city to make themselves look better by making the reporter look bad. That's Roy 101. Blaming people.
A paper can be sued if they lie. Why would the CALL want to be sued? Someone at city hall screwed up and now they're doing everything they can to make the mean, nasty, old CALL look bad. You ask me who I trust more between a paper that has a legal obligation to be accurate and an administration that seems to make "policy" at the drop of a hat without even telling aldermen about it, it's easy. I have much more confidence in the paper's honesty than an administration that twists and bends the facts to fit their self serving needs. It all starts at the top too. Remember that and you'll realize why things are so screwed up right now.
Here's an issue we need to address, why is Roy afraid of the press reporting what he does?
12:12PM 7/3 blogger: Good idea, in fact I am going to make your question into a main thread, let's see what wvwryone thinks about this.
Tom Ford
Could Not Be Said Better
Written by a housewife from New Jersey and sounds like it! This is one angry lady. . . and for good reason
"Are we fighting a war on terror or aren't we? Was it or was it not
started by Islamic people who brought it to our shores on September 11, 2001 ?
Were people from all over the world, mostly Americans, not brutally murdered that day, in downtown Manhattan , across the Potomac from our nation's capitol and in a field in Pennsylvania ? Did nearly three thousand men, women and children die a horrible, burning or crushing death that day, or didn't they? And I'm supposed to care that a copy of the Koran was "desecrated" when an overworked American soldier kicked it or got it wet?...Well, I don't. I don't care at all.
I'll start caring when Osama bin Laden turns himself in and repents
for incinerating all those innocent people on 9/11. I'll care about the Koran when the fanatics in the Middle East start caring about the Holy Bible, the mere possession of which is a crime in Saudi Arabia . I'll care when these thugs tell the world they are sorry for hacking off Nick Berg 's head while Berg screamed through his gurgling slashed throat. I'll care when the cowardly so-called "insurgents" in Iraq come out and fight like men instead of disrespecting their own religion by hiding in mosques.
I'll care when the mindless zealots who blow themselves up in search of nirvana care about the innocent children within range of their suicide bombs. I'll care when the American media stops pretending that their First Amendment liberties are somehow derived from international law instead of the United States Constitution's Bill of Rights.
In the meantime, when I hear a story about a brave marine roughing up an Iraqi terrorist to obtain information, know this: I don't care. When I see a fuzzy photo of a pile of naked Iraqi prisoners who have been humiliated in what amounts to a college-hazing incident, rest assured: I don't care. When I see a wounded terrorist get shot in the head when he is told not to move because he might be booby-trapped, you can take it to the bank: I don't care. When I hear that a prisoner, who was issued a Koran and a prayer mat, and fed "special" food that is paid for by my tax dollars, is complaining that his holy book is being "mishandled," you can absolutely believe in your heart of hearts: I don't care.
And oh, by the way, I've noticed that sometimes it's spelled "Koran and other times "Quran." Well, Jimmy Crack Corn and -you guessed it Ã,â?"I don't care ! ! ! ! ! If you agree with this viewpoint, pass this on to all your e-mail friends. Sooner or later, it'll get to the people responsible for this ridiculous behavior!
If you don't agree, then by all means hit the delete button. Should
you choose the latter, then please don't complain when more atrocities committed by radical Muslims happen here in our great country! And may
I add: "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the Marines don't have that problem." -- Ronald Reagan
I have another quote that I would like to add AND .......I hope you
forward all this.
"If we ever forget that we're One Nation Under God, then we will be a
nation gone under." Also by.. Ronald Reagan
One last thought for the day:
In case we find ourselves starting to believe all the anti-American
sentiment and negativity, we should remember England 's Prime Minister
Tony Blair 's words during a recent interview. When asked by one of his Parliament members why he believes so much in America , he said:
"A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want
in... And how many want out."
Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you:
1. Jesus Christ
2. The American G. I.
One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
YOU MIGHT WANT TO PASS THIS ON, AS MANY SEEM TO FORGET BOTH OF THEM.
AMEN
6:03 PM blogger: Amen is right, now lets see how many "holier than thou" liberals will dispute this and call you a "Raciest, zenophobe" for your remarks!
Bless you, and keep em coming!
Tom Ford
Never, and I mean Never, have I seen so much written about so little. The utter nonsense and sophmoric bent of the blogger, whose obvious love affair with the CALL, has provided me with mirth and laughter beyond all words. I feel so grown up when I read the ridiculous retorts of this doe-doe, whose identity is not really a secret. Uh, water on the brain is it? Maybe swimmers ear. My gosh, this person is totally unbalanced. One would think Crestwood is in the midst of becomming extinct. Floods, Fires, Earthquakes, Hurricanes, Tornados, Mudslides,Terrorism, gas prices - and Crestwood is hiding meetings! Good Grief. This is serious stuff!
Crestwood general meetings are not only posted, but have remained fixed for years. I would presume one has only to let the city know they want special notification and provide an e-mail address. Also, they can go onto the city's site, or better yet call city hall. Engraved invitations are not in the annual budget. Making a mountain out of this molehill has all the makings of someone who hates this city, hates people, hates progress, hates 9 people on the BOA who really don't need this antagnostic pathetic soul constantly scratching the itch of hate. These 9 men and our city employees who have more things to do than acknowledge crackpots, surely must wonder if there is some sort of spray for this weasel. But then, if it stopped, I would lose one of my sources of entertainment, and this sicko would lose their whole sense of being. Their reason to live. Can't have that. I just consider the source and thank my stars that my Peanut Butter Sandwich has jelly on it.
"Never, and I mean Never, have I seen so much written about so little."
I guess it depends on who is in charge of city hall, no? If this had happened a couple of years ago, the ranting would have gone on for months.
Could be. Could be. However, sure seems to be getting lots and lots of ranting currently, this Sunshine Law business. So, go ahead, and make it last. Let's keep this a goin. We can do it. This is the classy way we operate, right. Right out of the "Lessons from Bowtie" book. Let's drag old Crestwood down; let's encourage the rag to do the same. Let's plant every seed of distrust we can. This is our lifeblood, our reason to incorporate. Yo, Ho, Ho!! We'll call this civic duty. Crestwood just can't get over itself. A 60 year old city with a cold war raging all the time. Pimples and pocks all the time. Adolesance.How cool is this!
Of course the time you mention back then, the city was in mutiny. Mismanagement of funds, City Administrators checking out. Negative audits. Seems there was paper shredding parties, harrassment suits, bills being paid with borrowed money, hanky pank at city hall, bigggggg legal bills with no descriptions, efforts to build a 14.5 M dollar city hall so it too could be collateral to the bank, pre mature Charter Board meetings, undecipherable spread sheets, no civil service for employees, and a Developer poised to ask Crestwood to reimburse them the 850,000 they paid to the private swim club, (which now sits disturbingly in between 2 residentail neighborhood backyards) for their old pool appraised at 225,000 (nice going there guys) to be used for a parking lot for Kohls, which sits empty. "Sunshine," are you kidding me. Where, When?
This whole thing really has me wondering. I just didn't know that clandestine meetings were being held within the sacred halls of our city hall. Are our Die Hard 9 up there spinning straw into gold? From the looks of things, this would be a step in the right direction.
That's all fine and dandy. But what has that to do with the city's new financial mess? I'm sorry. I believe Frank Meyers called it a financial "storm". Should the paper not write about that since it's not good news?
Anyone using things from three or four years ago to defend the city's new financial "storm" is severely misguided and LIVING IN THE PAST. Live in the now. We've got a storm a brewin now that needs more of our attention than anything from even a year ago
I hate to burst your bubble, but it's the past that got us where we are now.
How much debt was left over from the police station project?
How much was owed in legal bills?
That may be. But we don't need excuses right now. We need answers. Until the worn out tradition of blaming that's gone on many years in Crestwood ends, I fear we'll continue to see more blame than answers. It's okay to disagree with someone. That's a healthy part of problem solving. But you're right. The blaming has to stop.
Good idea, sell that one to the CALL!
" but it's the past that got us where we are now."
Maybe you don't get it. Prop S is taking care of the past debt.
The deficit now and in the future was NOT caused by the past administration/BOA. Period.
I do get it. Crestwood wouldn't need Prop S if previous administrations didn't spend so much. Period.
if the previous administrations spent so much, how come their budgets where in the black and the current administrations budgets are going into the red?
Period!
Exclamation point!
Did you hear about the guy who had part of his intestine removed?
Now he has a semi-colon...
The previous administration was in the black? Well spreadsheets can be deceiving now can't they? Twould seem that some folks are just color blind. Consider the facts and how they came to be. Hey, this is your city. Believe what you want. Facts are facts and I only remember being told we could use a miracle.
Check out the BOA meeting tonight. I think the "paper" is going to get their collective hat's handed to them by a resident, reference the "sunshine law!"
Should be interesting to see what they print in the next issue!
Tom Ford
so did the hat get handed to them by the local resident? What is wrong with your sources these days since you were cut off from the Call, dont attend meetings and the Times and Journal dont cover squat in their articles about Crestwood?
I wanted to buy a hat at Kohl's but I couldn't afford it. The sales tax was way too high.
Read all the 54 comments. Haven't been able to blog for several months, but I see that it's the same old bickering just a different day. Read whatever paper that floats your boat, and take whatever side you wish as far as this administration or the last one or this CA or the previous one. Truth is....people don't change and believe what they want to believe. It doesn't matter if you show them proof in budget numbers, audits, quotes, or if you show them things in black and white in minute books, or an 8 x 10 glossy.
I say you stop the nonsense, relax, take a deep breath and call it a day. This tripe gets you nowhere. Try some milk of magnesia, sounds like some of you need a good cleaning out.
Peace be with you!
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