Problems in Sunset Hills development circles?
This is interesting folks, it seems as though if your a Mayor of any community in south county your going to be disliked by someone!
I thought that this was a done deal for the new office/condo project, but alas, up jumps the devil in the form of TDD,CID's, and whatever!
Now the natives are very restless, the Mayor (of all people) is being slammed, and darn if it's not starting to sound like Crestwood!
For the "rest of the story" please click on the header to be directed to the South County Times story.
Tom Ford
NO. 425
I thought that this was a done deal for the new office/condo project, but alas, up jumps the devil in the form of TDD,CID's, and whatever!
Now the natives are very restless, the Mayor (of all people) is being slammed, and darn if it's not starting to sound like Crestwood!
For the "rest of the story" please click on the header to be directed to the South County Times story.
Tom Ford
NO. 425
posted by Crestwood Independent at 14:17
76 Comments:
"Hunzeker said said the additional sales tax revenue is projected to be $275,000 per year by 2012. He said the city's projected budget deficit for 2008 is expected to be $212,000."
Wow, were not as bad off with the nine grand plus as you thought we were!
Tom Ford
Ahm, Crestwood's projected deficit for the year 2012 was over $3mil. How does that equate to $275,000?
It dosen't, but then again, our budget is balanced for he third year in a row. Sunset Hills is out by $212,000.00!
"AHEM!" Projected is just that, we shall see nex year where it stands.
Tom Ford
TIF and TDD has eminent domain power for right-aways and cross-access rights which could be your property.
I think it is great that the developers and property owners of a TIF, TDD, and CID can vote their own sales tax rate and use eminent domain to have another drive-way.
Move over--your property is next in line for a TDD for a road or driveway!
Wasn't Sansone's a member of Crestwood Swim Club?
Wasn't Sansone the first developer for Kohl's, Sunset Manor, and Big Bend Crossing for Sam's?
Why does Sansone always start the TIF, TDD, and CID process and then backs out?
How much does Sansone make in backing out of these deals or do they become a LLC stockholder or landowner with a TIF?
Do they buy out all of the property when it drops in value like in Sunset Manor?
Is Attorney Gary Vincent representing Sansone since they are listed as a client with his firm?
Is that whay Attorney Gary Vincent moved to Sunset Hills?
Why don't you ask Gary Vincent your questions?
I can't, he seems to be in seclusion in Sunset hills, and the "pool" is closed!
Darn sure then, you wont get his answer by asking him on this blog, so what is your point in doing so? More mud slinging.
It is not mud slinging when the truth is revealed!
Do as Attorney Gary Vincent wants you to do "Shut Up!"
No, do as Gary Vincent wants you do, ask him.
Thank goodness for bringing Crestwood Swim Club back onto this blog. That's the only time it really gets interesting.
Other that to give the Mayor running poll, there is no other reason for it being on the internet
Wasn't Sansone's a member of Crestwood Swim Club? More likley the Bogey Club in Ladue.
Wasn't Sansone the first developer for Kohl's, Sunset Manor, and Big Bend Crossing for Sam's? NO
Why does Sansone always start the TIF, TDD, and CID process and then backs out? When have they backed out? Sunset Plaza and across the street were great projcets that saved Sunset Hills from finacial disaster.
How much does Sansone make in backing out of these deals or do they become a LLC stockholder or landowner with a TIF?
Yes, what happens when a developer comes back with a Mega-TIF for the mall? Didn't the paid consultant say $275M to redevelop the mall?
Show me a developer that doesn't ask for these incentives...We gave 2 CIDs out in Crestwood because the property owner let his properties fall into disrepair. You get rewarded for not reinvesting in your property...unless of course you are a homeowner!
Went to Crestwood mall last night to shop. It has been awhile, but with Christmas just around the corner....
Why would anyone want to go to Crestwood Plaza??????
Better be prepared for a total closing of the mall. I guess a plan 'B' should be in order.
Hopefully the supporters of the mayor will put a bug in his ear and tell him to wake up! Additional sales tax revenues from the newer developments CANNOT make up for the loss of the mall sales tax revenue.
10:29 I think the mayor and board already know that we cannot make up revenue that will be lost with the closing of the Mall.
What matters now is how much can we shave off of the budget and make the necessary changes without jeopardizing our public safety departments.
The sooner people realize that just shaving the budget can only take us so far, the better their understanding of what to do in the future.
I hope that the mayor and board realize that we need to have a good tax increase to help us get back where we were to keep Crestwood going.
You can see what is happening today with depending on new commercial revenues. Developers all want TIF's or CID's to help their enterprises. We just cannot keep existing with only sales tax expectations. We need to have something more to sustain us.
You can see that other communities all pay more in taxes, much more than we ever have, and they are thriving wonderfully. Kirkwood is a perfect example. They pay more per household but it works. Their property values are great and they have a wonderful business corridor that is family friendly and caters to families.
We need a tax increase and although it is a dirty word, when you stop to consider that 30 years ago, we were almost paying what we pay now, I think it is time.
Thank you.
What size of the increase in our property taxes should Mayor ask for? Should he do it now or after the election in April 2008?
What will Tim ask for?
5:34 PM The mayor and board of aldermen should decide when and if we should increase property taxes. How much of an increase also needs to be studied and developed and is not something you just come up with on a whim. This is a very serious issue.
I am not sure it can be developed in time for April, 2008. But some people will say that Roy would use this as a political tool for his re-election. However, some would also not have one good thing to say about him anyway or by any stretch of the imagination. So they would never vote for anything that had his sanction on it, be it good or bad for the city, be it before or after April.
It would be political to some people, which does nothing for the city as a whole, but that is how people are. They would "shoot themselves in the foot" just to spite Roy. I say stick to the issue, can we survive without a tax increase. I say no.
I really don't care when they put a tax increase out there for us, in April, or November or sometime in the next year or so. I would strictly be voting on the issue that would best serve Crestwood. Plain and simple. I am not one for politics over everything.
4:31 PM, November 30, 2007
Kirkwood has high taxes and substantial retail tax revenue. Do you ever drive down Lindbergh?
They also provide more services and have a much bigger government than Crestwood. Kirkwood also has many more $400K + homes than Crestwood that are willing and able to pay more taxes.
Did you forget that we just passed Prop "S" not long ago?
This mall redevelopment needs high income housing that attracts younger folks if it's going to work. People who are going to spend their money...It's no secret a good deal of Crestwood is senior aged. Not the ideal target for retailers.
How long should it take for our City Fathers to figure out how much increase in property tax we need to keep our fire dept?
Don't you think that if they were really doing their job they woud know already? After all, they know the rate of decline in sales tax income, and as any of us can do, they can see the half empty parking lots at the mall. Regardless of the Mehlville offer, they should have been working on this answer long ago.
9:56 OK then don't use Kirkwood as a comparison. Don't use any community to compare. I remember the Proposition. It isn't bringing us any more money and it didn't help.
Passing an increase in property tax isn't going to fair well with some of you. I am not a genius and I could be wrong but I don't think you have to be a genius to figure out that we are going to need more capital to keep this city going whether we passed one or ten propositions. I don't think the numbers lie and they tell me something bigger has to happen.
I am just another cog in the wheel and so are you. We don't run the City so you can have your opinion and I respect that; but I also have mine.
Thank you.
9:03 am I addressed your comment in another message on the blog.
You have placed this comment on every blog heading. I think that the powers that be have been holding off on mentioning tax increase to anybody. They have been trying to cut costs other ways.
But when you go to the town hall meeting, you can ask them that question because all we can do is speculate.
With new people on the board of aldermen, maybe we can get some answers to our questions, but in the meantime, we are merely second guessing everything.
They sit on the dais, no us; they have work sessions and meetings.
But to have elected people tell you straight out that we need a tax increase, I don't know if they want to stick their neck out yet on that one. It is a very scary topic to them, politically.
Many elected officials in the past were too busy trying to keep their constituents to get re-elected to ask them for a tax increase.
To some, not all, that has always been the most important thing. Hopefully the young guns can get it done.
As there is only one job open for anyone to be running next for election,can one assume that you are talking about our mayor being to busy to talk about taxes?
Someone just told me that the mayor already stated "no new taxes" and it is on record.
So, you tell me the next step to be taken! I haven't a clue what's next.
get a honest person to run against the mayor would be the best step.
Well if you know someone who is honest, let us all in on it. However, when the deadline for filing comes around soon, we will see what happens.
9:25 PM December 1st
The Mayor is free to express his opinion regarding a tax increase; if the aldermen disagree with his position, section 4.4 (b) of the city's charter gives them to power to override a mayoral veto with a three-fourths majority.
Martha Duchild
11:14 AM blogger: Indeed my friend! It is a heck of a lot easier to talk a good game than to play it!
Running for Mayor will bring out ALL the skeletons from the closet of the hapless soul who does it. It will require more than the faint of heart, and the thin skinned to get it done.
If Roy has a chalenger they will be insulted, subjected to an a*&l exam by the media (as Roy is now,) and have to listen to countless hours of drivel from God knows who!
In my opinion, Roy has done a good job with what he was given, and if there is someone else who feels they know better, well, get the signature's, pay the five bucks, and go for it! I know one thing for sure, I wouldent want it on a silver platter!
Tom Ford
1:33 Thanks Martha. Once again, you are clear and concise. I knew that the aldermen could override the mayor's veto, I just didn't know where to look.
People keep blaming everything on the Mayor and I knew that somewhere in the books there was a way to make the aldermen accountable, if they so choose to be.
But it is going to take courage for our aldermen to grasp this tax concept and put it out there for the people.
Too soon to tell.
Roy has done a terrible job with what he was given! What has he done that is worthy of any praise? You your self have started a line of questions about tax increases which Roy would not talk about. What was the City's debt when he took over, what is it now? How much interest are we paying for Roy's "note", vs. the interest we would have paid if Roy had not played politics and had supported Fagan's "bond" issue?
Roy has done nothing to re secure my vote this next time as he hasn't talked about why he should be re-elected. He didn't stop the police palace, the people did. Don't give that crock about he didn't know how bad things were until he got into office, remember, he said the budget should be on 1 page and that we didn't need computers, just a couple of secretaries and pencils. You don't want to blame him for the decline in the Mall, but you sure did blame former Mayors for their failure to do something about the decline on their watch. Roy has even attacked Miguel for wanting a Plan B for 2008 because it might infer that things are not all peachy n Crestwood. That's who is going to get my write in vote if he doesnt file, Miguel.
So now we are faced with the real possibility of mall failure due to lack of leadership. Look at his budget, it stinks of politics top to bottom, $30,000 for legal, nothing for communications that citizens can use.
Give me one thing Roy has promised to do if given another 3 years that I can vote for him about? He is really hoping no one runs against him because he has nothing to offer.
4:56 PM There is no one who can tell us what would have happened if Roy would have been defeated by Tom Fagan. Your comment isn't new and has been hashed out on this blog a number of times.
However, I do know that Tom would have had his "hands full" just as Roy does. You cannot walk into a new job and be aware of every single thing that is going on or know exactly what you are up against. If you or anyone thinks that you can walk into a new position and not have unanticipated problems occur, you are not being honest in your assessment.
Whether it be Roy or someone new in 2008, the mayor and board of aldermen are going to have their hands full. The decisions made in 2008 are so signficantly crucial to Crestwood and of such magnitude, that to blame just one person for the reason why we are in this mess is really not fair.
This mess has many phases, starting a long time ago when Crestwood depended on sales tax revenues "alone" to sustain us, and never felt the need to ask their citizens to balance those revenues by slowly increasing taxes to keep up with inflationary costs. We have basically done nothing for over 30 years except depend on sales tax. Money was flowing out of Crestwood for everything including a "pay as you go" community center.
Now we need to get off of dead center and bite the bullet and balance our city coffers with a tax increase; something that is long overdue. How much? I don't know that, but it needs to be something realistic. That is for the elected officials to say, not us.
You can make all the cuts you want in the budget, but this city needs one big "booster shot" to get us back again.
But to say that this would not have happened if somebody else became mayor instead of Roy makes no sense. This mess didn't happen overnight. It has been coming for a very long time.
Before Roy, before Tom Fagan, before Robertson, Pat Killoren and the aldermen never, ever in the wildest dreams wanted to increase taxes. That was tabu and that word was considered a sacrilege.
But it should have been done that long ago. Unfortunately, nobody had the foresight to prepare for today. To scared to be alienated by their constituency.
And Roy is still acting that way, even though no one is running aginst him.
One correction, Fagan supported the bond issue when he ran against Roy, turns out he was right after all, it would have been the best thing to have happened.
7:19 AM Good Morning whoever you are!
Well good for you if you feel that this city should have built a new 14 million dollar police station!!! Since we obviously have no money to maintain it down the road, we had no business doing it.
Do you take out a 75,000 loan to buy a new expensive car with all the bells and whistles, when you know down the line that you can't afford to pay the taxes and what you bring in each month isn't enough to make the car payments?
Do you think that Tom Fagan knew we were broke when he was listening to "the man who would be King", Don Greer! I don't. I think Tom was backstabbed and lied to by Don Greer. No, Don Greer didn't lie, he just didn't tell the whole truth on anything.
Also, while we were glorifying our police with new everything, what where we going to do with our Fire Station? Do they not deserve the same? Also, since we didn't have enough money to purchase a brand new fire truck years before, and they had to buy a "used fire truck", for 200,000, how could we not see that we were hurting for money before the "police facility" was on drafting paper?
I do not agree with you on this, but feel you are entitled to what you believe. I am just stating my view.
Dear poster 11:34,
The Bond Issue (using Roy's logic that is like a "Note")that Mayor Fagan supported, was not to purchase a police station, but to pay off the debt like Roy's Note (like a bond) is trying to do.
Truth is Roy's "note" is costing us higher interest than Fagan' Bond would have if the voters had approved it.
The Police station had already been funded when the voters passed the extension of the Sunset on the Capital Improvements Sales tax. The money had already been collected. The Bonds for that had already been sold even though the Board at that time had been told by then C/A Lichlighter that they hadn't been.
Don't believe me, go to the minutes and do your research, or ask tom.
11:52 am Thanks for the clarification. I appreciate that.
But here is another thought. I still feel that Tom Fagan lost the election because he kept Greer in two important positions. I think that was too much power for one person, and in time it still would not have been enough for Greer.
First Greer got Tom's trust and after that he had his own agenda and was sure he could get anything he so desired out of this city.
Tom Fagan should have never trusted him. Greer played both sides again the middle before, with previous city officials, there would have been no reason not to do it again.
Greer never felt a sense of honor or duty to anybody else but himself. And sooner or later, Greer would have wanted to be Mayor too, as well as CA and Police Chief because he felt he deserved it for his own edification not out of a sense of duty as the protector of Crestwood and its people. He wanted total control, so how else would you get total control? Greer told me that he wanted total control.
When Greer slammed his hand on his desk and said to me, "I am the City of Crestwood and it is my world now", he summed up his whole criteria in a nutshell.
So, with Tom as mayor and Greer as CA, Police Chief, and building a brand new police facility, I still say that Tom would have had his hands full. And I really don't see how he or anybody else could make this mess go away in 3 years.
Tom Fagan lost the election because he gave Greer too much power. That's my view and that of many residents.
Thanks again for your input and I appreciate your clear, concise answer. I believe what you have said and I thank you again for your comment.
You are absolutely right 4:37. Tom Fagan cost himself his own election becuase of Greer, plain and simple! Tom was a very nice man but he was blind when it came to Don. Plus, we absolutely needed a full time Mayor which is what we've got now. You may not agree with everything he says or does, I don't, but you have to admit we are a lot better off because of him. There is still more work to be done and he has my vote again. I hear rumors the Tim Trueblood is going to run. I sincerely hope for his sake that he doedn't. I think he will be very surprised at the lack of support he will recieve especially from his own ward. I'm sure the Call will get behind him because that means they would have another mouthpiece back in there just like when he was an aldermen.
Did Chief Greer ever wreck a city provided car after having a few drinks with his buddy the mayor?
Did Chief Greer live in Crestwood where he worked or Hillsboro?
Talk to me about honor.
Yeah, Don did live in Crestwood. If he was not at home you could find him at the home of his girlfriend the finance director.
11:12 There is no honor among thieves. He did a lot of things that are far worse than what you stated. Just let this topic alone because if you think he deserved honor, then you honor him. Don't expect everyone else to do the same.
Is it true what the poster said about our current Police Chief?
So it is a bad thing for two single people to date each other? Is is ok for the City to hire gay people? Is it anybody's business?
3:49 PM If you feel that what the new police chief is so all fired important, then what the previous police chief did, is also important. More fun though pointing your finger at this one HUH?
If you want to throw rocks at the new chief, then allow me to throw rocks at the old one.
If the new police chief is only hurting himself by what he does and isn't hurting others like Don Greer did, I can't say it is OK but that is his choice. And like you said, it is nobody's business.
When Don Greer did things, people got hurt, were given ultimatims, were demoted,threatened with being fired, as well as covering up for some bad behavior by his pal who he made a Major. To protect this sexual harrasser in the police department it cost the city $40,000$20,000 each for two female cops. Doubt whether what this police chief has done cost the city that much. And that was only a few of his favorite things.
Comparing people might get you in trouble because there are countless things the previous chief did that were unacceptable, and you can sing his song as much as you so desire, but don't expect everybody to join in.
Unless you were subjected to threats and disgustingly harsh words that led to being afraid of loosing your job at the drop of his finger, keep your mouth shut cause you don't know the half of it.
So drunk driving doesn't effect me? What if I or one of my family gets hit by him? Doesn't that effect me?
What about the money I pay in taxes to repair/replace the car he wrecked, does that effect me?
What about the gas he uses to go to and from work, does he pay for that or do I with my taxes?
You see, what he does, has an effect on me and you.
5:40 PM Hey Rocketman, slow down!I am not going to argue with you about this issue. So I guess if Mr. Greer didn't drink and drive, it made him a real upstanding guy in your eyes.
I gave you $40,000 worth of reasons why Greer ripped off the city, allowing his buddy in the Police Department to get by with sexually harrassing two female cops and keeping it hush, hush. $20,000 each.
I can also multiply $800 plus dollars times 12 months on his high end car that the city ended up paying every month. All the while, we all knew the city was broke. Like he really cared! Gosh, why didn't they do that for all department heads? Because Don Greer was a con and had street smarts from living with low-life people in "Podunk" or wherever he was from. Street smart people never change their ways.
Of course, Don Greer in your eyes, never had a DWI, or a DUI where he could have killed you or your kids or someone else, right? Only this police chief right?
Truth is, you don't have a clue about what Greer has done in his lifetime, nor do you want to know if he ever broke the law or put somebody in harms way. You just assume that only this police chief does that correct?
You obviously were one that had your head up Greer's butt when he was here, so why go on this with bantor.
If you read my other comment, you will see that I never said drinking and driving were OK and I never said it was right.
So take a hot shower and go to bed; now we all know that this police chief is just a horrible person. And you are so sure that Greer never had a DWI or a DUI or anything like that, right? And I am also sure that you are so dog gone sweaky clean that you can blurt out anything about anybody (that you can't stand) and make it sound like you are all about the safety of others; when we both know you are saying these things cause you can stand the new police chief and in your eyes Greer was above reproach. Give me a break.
What I have seen of Don Greer and heard him say and saw what he did to people, made me sick.
Carry on!
Are we finished here, cause if you go on with this rubbish much longer, I will have to guess that you are Diana Madrid.
Never mind.
I guess it is okay to be blinded by the past. Why care about what goes on today. Makes sense to me. NOT.
10:08 PM You and a few other bloggers before you this evening have totally missed the boat on your remarks. Why? Because this whole issue about Greer started very innocently in a remark that I made at 4:37 PM 12/4 and an answer I received at 8:24 PM 12/4.
I stated that Tom Fagan in my opinion lost the mayoral election because he gave Don Greer to important positions which was too much power for one person.
Therein was the only reason I ever mentioned Greer's name. The person to whom I made this comment to, agreed with me and that was all I wanted to get into about Greer.
Then, of course, some idiot had to get into a big snit about it, and had to tell everyone how bad this police chief is which was not the topic to begin with.
So, you know what? I don't give a rat's behind about people like you, who just can't stay on the same page with your comments.
You just have to open your horn mouth and say something totally unrelated to the comment, because you hate this police chief so much you just can't contain yourself.
What in God's name has your comments have anything to do with Tom Fagan's loss as mayor?
So, go about your rage and keep it going for all I care. The aforementioned is the sequence of events that started on this blog, as an opinion about what I feel about Fagan's loss as Mayor and why I think he was defeated.
Get it? Got it? Good!!!!!!
Give it up, your the one who has the rage. Got it?
12:02 If you say so!
Give it up, your the one who has the rage. Got it?
12:02 PM, December 06, 2007
DITTO !
My dear fellow bloggers: In case you missed it, WW2 is over, the Titanic sank, and Mr. Greer is, well shall we say, "departed!"
Who cares what he did? Let's move on to current events!
How about the "paper" quoting the Mayor reference the Crestwood Mall "good news!"
Tom Ford
NO TIF??
"Did Chief Greer ever wreck a city provided car after having a few drinks with his buddy the mayor?
Did Chief Greer live in Crestwood where he worked or Hillsboro?
Talk to me about honor."
11:12 PM, December 04, 2007
Is the above not also called rage and decension. Guess that remark is OK with you. I get it now.
It is a question that you are supposed to answer.
1:36 PM OK, I will answer it.
First of all, Don Greer never had a city car to wreck. He had his own BMW (cost $50,000 plus for a 500 series) that the city paid for at a cost of $800 per month. So, I doubt whether Mr. Greer would want his car all messed up by wrecking it; however, if it were damaged, whether he was drinking or not, do you really think that the city wouldn't end up paying for the damage? Plus had Mr. Greer been drinking and driving, nobody would have ever known about it because he would cover it up just like a lot of other things he did.
No, the present police chief does not live in Crestwood. That has always been something left up to the mayor, even though it is on the books that the chief must live in Crestwood. You can fault the Chief for that, if you want, I don't care, but it has nothing to do with honor if it is really up to the mayor to enforce.
In the past, Chief Loyd lived in Fenton. If this Chief doesn't live in Crestwood, I think your complaint comes out of the fact that he wasn't your choice for Chief in the first place.
In my view I think you are probably one of about four "sweeties" Greer had going on the side. No different from Wood River or any other place he worked. Check it out! Now that's honor? He womanized at least 3 that I know of; one quit after she had enough and one even quit after the first day. Sure, that's honor?
You have expressed yourself and have given your opinion of how you feel, so let me at least give mine.
If you want to further argue about it, maybe someone else can comment about it. I see no real need for it.
Good Gawd Alice, you are sure full of rage aren't you? I think you better re-check your facts on Greer never having a City car to drive, I believe he drove one before the much hated BMW.
No it is not the Chiefs fault that City has over looked the fact that he doesnt live in Crestwood, it is the Mayor and his Board's fault for hiring him when he lived in Jeff. County.
As far as womenizing goes, share with us the list of 3 women that you "know" were womenized by Greer. That is the least you can do after having spreading such a mean un-Christ like rumorlike you did. You see I plan on checking with them to get their side of your story.
P.S. I am not one of his 4 sweeties, what ever that is, nor am I a person who has the ablity to hate as deeply as youdo.
5:01 I told you it makes no difference what you think or say, I am done deliberating on this subject.
You are so smart and intuitive, you can find out the names of the women yourself. One was a woman cop who was married and whose husband had words with Greer to stay away from her, who lived in Franklin County; one was the girl he hired to be his secretary when Lori left the first time, who finally quit because he harrassed her and she was always in tears, and the third was a woman who he hired for one day to be his secretary and she never returned.
If you expect me to give you names, sorry you can find that out yourself.
Like I said, you started this ridiculous bantor about this police chief, but I know a lot about Mr. Greer.
If you insist on defending Don Greer, you are the one with the rage cause I don't care enough one way or the other to be enraged.
You are the one who couldn't stick to the subject in the first place, and had to open up on this police chief like it had been in your crawl for ages. Why do I say that? Because it had nothing to do with the specific blog comment and you just had to bring it out anyway, didn't you? Hope it made you feel good.
What I mean is, there has to be a reason why you got all "raged" up about this police chief.
The rage is in your corner first, and I still say, I have lots of facts that you don't care to know about Greer and to get you to believe me, I would need an 8 x 10 glossy of every incident to prove it to you. And then I still don't think you would believe me. Remember, there is only one God and it isn't Mr. Greer, although he thought he was.
So I refuse to bother myself going back and forth with a question and answer routine.
You liked Greer and dislike Paillou, and I have the opposite view and know the facts to back them up.
So you go ahead and play Sherlock Holmes if you so desire.
Have a nice evening.
What's the matter Diana, did you think you were the only one?
Cool, rumors without proof against a dead man. The highest form of low brow behaviour, not to be unexpected when you consider the source.
7:04 am No more low brow behavior than you saying things about Paillou, and no more than your presumption that you know who I am and calling me low brow and Un-Christian. I guess it is OK for you to say what is on your mind but not anybody else, is that it?
If you want to call what I say rumor, I have no problem with it, that's an assumption on your part.
But let's be fair, if you can condemn Paillou, I have the right to do the same thing to someone I disliked, Don Greer. Therein is the only difference in our comments.
Don't throw stones at me for doing what you did, and I will not throw stones at you.
Hope this can end, because all we express is a difference of opinion. You can keep it up if that's what floats your boat, frankly, nobody really cares one way or the other.
My original question about Mr. Greer was not directed to you in the first place, but to another blogger, and I received my answer from that blogger. You however used my comment to belittle Chief Paillou. You were the one who ran your mouth off and name called so now I quit.
It's Christmas. Let it go.
You can find the data on current chief that I posted in the reports covering the towing of the car and those made by the police at the scene of the wreck. Further, you admitted he didn't live in Crestwood. You agreed that the residence item was an issue.
So what I posted would be easy enough to support and in fact you seem to do so yourself. What you posted about Mr. Greer you can not or will not support, it is you who belittle a dead man without evidence of your claims. That is the difference! It is your hate that floats your boat.
3:22 PM What is wrong with you for heaven sake. I finally think I know who you are, judging from your tone. And we have had this conversation before on the phone haven't we?
And if you are that person, I cannot believe that you would go to such lengths as to intimate that Don Greer was some kind of saint and didn't have a real wicked side as you cast your anger toward Paillou for bad things done. How can you think Greer was infallible? You are smarter than that, my dear.
My God must this go on forever? Believe me, I could never show as much distain for Mr. Greer or anybody as you do about the new police chief nor would I put up such a "rage" as you do. Therein you have really showed me who you are by continually trying to make a big federal case out of this. I never liked the guy but it doesn't mean that I would say things without proof. I have proof. Just because I cannot devuldge some names, you feel I am a liar. Not true.
Fact: Greer made his buddy and friend a major in the crestwood police department. The major sexually harrassed two female cops in the police department. They filed suit with Mary Ann Saday, as their attorney. Each female cop got $20,000 each from the City of Crestwood. It is in the records too. Check it out if you don't believe me. It is on the books. That's 40,000 of taxpayers money. I heard about it because one of the female cops told me herself while I stood up at the Kisok.
Was this man forced to resign because of his misdeeds? No. He was given time to find another job and when he didn't find one, Greer found one for him, so he could leave. Not one word was said about it. Greer covered it up. If you were his buddy, things were covered up, if you were part of the previous administration, he had no use for you. Now are you going to tell me that it didn't happen? Then to add insult to injury, Greer called the Major back to teach the same two female cops how to use some computer equipment in their police cars. How about that. Guess I am making that up too.
Those are facts. So now you can give me some lame excuse to make theose facts look false, but nevertheless $40,000 was put out and the people in the finance department made the checks out so they are public record.
When it comes to your sqeeky clean friend Don Greer, you are not going to make me feel bad because the man is now deceased and I have spoken how I feel toward him.
I never wished him to die, never would wish it on anybody. Am I going to lie and say anything good about him, no but I will pray for the repose of his soul.
If you are defending your old boss, because he was good to you, I never said he was bad to everyone. But please don't accuse me of making up lies. Let's face it, you would defend him if he committed mass murder.
Now get off of my back. I just cannot understand why I cannot make a statement about somebody I don't care for but you can say things about Paillou who you don't care for. That's not fair is it?
You can thank God I am not on your back. You will not get the last word on this, maybe you get that at home with your husband, but not here with me.
Did I post any thing in error about Chief P? If no, then why cant it be posted with you posting/whining, "Greer did worse"?
I'll tell you why, you are so full of hate and rage that you look for Greer in everything that happens to you. Sick, real sick.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Poster 9:43, Pretty sure that Ms. Grave is not the poster. Sounds and reads more like Mrs. Donald Clark.
9:43 AM Blogger: I deleted your post due to the referenct to a word we don't use here!
Also, I doubt you know who the blogger was that was posting what apparently got you going.
It is the holiday season and to tghat end I advise you to keep it clean, and nice!
Tom Ford
For the record, there are a host of people who know the facts about Don Greer. They are indefutable and they were costly to the city. The people of Crestwood deserve and deserved much better. Memories of this CA/PC are not in the least pleasant. The wounds are long to heal. It is a shame that Fagan was so blinded and short on time to let this man shortchange our city. Poor judgement. This was gross negligance on his part. As bad, was Truebloods total fascination by Greer. He and Fagan made it possible for Greer to run roughshod over the city. It is totally mindboggling to realize this past Mayor and Alderman along with their ilk were so intoxicated with Greer and the sound of their own voices. This ilk, the one which is so blood thirsty for a Plan and thinks that they can redeem themselves by roasting the new Mayor, are actually the PLAN. That plan being the one to get rid of them. Mission Accomplished! Please, don't even suggets Trueblood could run for Mayor. He should be running for the state line. Ward 2 Aldermen for the most part have been a disgrace.
And there are those of us who see deeper than the tabloid crud spread around. Trueblood would make an excellent mayor, not just a step above what we have, but a whole staircase. Fagan, Greer, and the rest of the crowd didn't have time enough to prove or disprove anything.
If you say so.
11:43am....good for you Mrs. Trueblood.
Trueblood, I don't think so. There is only one person that feels he is far superior to any of us. We couldn't possibly think deeper than the tabloids, cause we are the lower class and don't travel in the proper social circles where the elite meet. We are way too inferior to hold a candle to his great knowledge of the City of Crestwood. Wonder who taught him so well.
6:43 PM blogger: Come now, Mr. Tim would be a great Mayor, however he has this small problem with "excess baggage."
It's way too soon for him to run now, people still remember remarks made from the audience reference services that may not be provided due to who the person is.
Tom Ford
Please Tom...stop with this crap about him being a "great Mayor". Don't tell me you drank the Trueblood Kool-Aid too?
After reading things on this blog, there are a few things learned. First, there are the Roy haters, and the Roy supporters. Comments are made by people, but regardless, people don't change their opinions and should not be chastised for it.
There are Trueblood supporters and haters. Comments are made by people, but regardless, people don't change their opinions and should not be chastised for it.
There are Greer supporters and Greer haters. Comments are made by people, but regardless, people don't change their opinions and should not be chastised for it.
There are Fagan supporters and Fagan haters. Comments are made by people, but regardless, people don't change their opinions and should not be chastised for it.
There are Frank Myer supporters and Frank Myer haters. Comments are made by people, but regardless, people don't change their opinions and should not be chastised for it.
There are those who sign their names and those who don't on this blog. Most people choose not to, as they are too afraid of the wrath of the ignorant souls who will turn them inside out.
Some who wish to remain anonymous use the blog and feel it is OK to go over the line using the four letter word against any person as part of their comment.
What's the point. Opinions are opinions. Everybody doesn't have to be afraid to disagree with others to state the way they feel. When bad words are exchanged, more bad words come out and it becomes contagious.
Those who choose to use this blog as a way to get their hate out by using the F word, should do us all a favor and get their own blog.
11:23 PM blogger: Please re-read my post, It's a bit "Tongue in cheek," and no I havent " drank the coolaid!"
2:11 PM blogger: Well said, well stated, and the gospel truth as far as I am conserned!
This is a "BLOG!" that is to say it's an "opinion piece," a place for everyone's comment's, and not a spot to show us you lack of vocabulary by using foul language!
If you wish to do that please go to Moveon.org, and rant with those idiot's!
Tom Ford
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