His Honors comments in the "Crestwood Connections."
Sorry, under normal circumstances I would post the entire comment by The Mayor, but, well, they are not posted yet!
I will however post something that I fully agree with, so here goes!
"The coming Aldermanic election will be very important in whether the redevelopment becomes a reality. I would encourage you to ask the candidates where they stand on the redevelopment of the mall, and if they support the efforts to get it accomplished. This is probebly the Cities most important project, and has to be accomplished to insure the future of our City."
Your Honor, your right, will the new candidates be willing to give a TIF, TDD, CID for this, or will they stand firm and tell the developers, a resounding NO?
The last time out, we went along with the idea that we needed another department store, and we got Kohls. What did that brilliant plan do for us? Well the swim club got a Saddam Husein type facility, we got a parking lot, and we lost Macy's!
Ready to do it again? Well, I am not, so PLEASE vote for the candidate in your ward who will put the best interest of Crestwood before the interest of Lord knows who!
Folks, this is as serious as it get's, and unless we elect a Alder person who will NOT spout the party line on that Dias, were in deep trouble!
I agree with "His Honor," ask that question, find out what they really believe, and then vote for the person who will listen to you, not the "party line" that has been spoon fed to us over the last 3 1/2 years!
Crestwood is our home, vote for Crestwood not some ridiculous claim that will only increase our taxes at the school district level, for surly, every TIF, TDD, CID is going to hit you on the backside as the school district looses for certain!
Tom Ford
NO. 601
I will however post something that I fully agree with, so here goes!
"The coming Aldermanic election will be very important in whether the redevelopment becomes a reality. I would encourage you to ask the candidates where they stand on the redevelopment of the mall, and if they support the efforts to get it accomplished. This is probebly the Cities most important project, and has to be accomplished to insure the future of our City."
Your Honor, your right, will the new candidates be willing to give a TIF, TDD, CID for this, or will they stand firm and tell the developers, a resounding NO?
The last time out, we went along with the idea that we needed another department store, and we got Kohls. What did that brilliant plan do for us? Well the swim club got a Saddam Husein type facility, we got a parking lot, and we lost Macy's!
Ready to do it again? Well, I am not, so PLEASE vote for the candidate in your ward who will put the best interest of Crestwood before the interest of Lord knows who!
Folks, this is as serious as it get's, and unless we elect a Alder person who will NOT spout the party line on that Dias, were in deep trouble!
I agree with "His Honor," ask that question, find out what they really believe, and then vote for the person who will listen to you, not the "party line" that has been spoon fed to us over the last 3 1/2 years!
Crestwood is our home, vote for Crestwood not some ridiculous claim that will only increase our taxes at the school district level, for surly, every TIF, TDD, CID is going to hit you on the backside as the school district looses for certain!
Tom Ford
NO. 601
posted by Crestwood Independent at 20:09
35 Comments:
Tom,
Do you really believe that Macy's left because Kohl's was across the street?
Using that form of logic, why did Stix sell to Dillards? Then why did Dillards leave, because of Sams?
I disliked the TIF for Kohl's and the Swim Club deal and voted against them while on the Board, but I can not find any proof that Kohl's caused the decline of Famous Barr/Macys.
Fact is the retail market has had one rule above all and that is location, location, location. Hence The Bluffs in Fenton, West and South County Mall are alive and well and our Mall is not.
One of the ideas that was bounced around was when Sunset Hills was hashing out the Novis redevelopment which rubbed up to Ward Two along Rayburn and I44. The idea which never got past being an idea was to see if the homeowners along I44 who had expressed a real problem with the noise from the Interstate would be interested in selling to a developer who would then build a New Crestwood Mall. Then the idea was to take the old Mall and direct its development into housing like in New Town in St.Charles but on a smaller scale.
An idea which never grew past just being that as the Mayor and City Admin. at that time came under increasing opposition for their plans to develop the property at the corner of Watson and Grant in to upscale housing and retail mix and, well you know the rest of the story.
Anyway Tom, I have to disagree with you regarding the relationship of Macy's closing and Kohl's opening. The rest of the post is right on.
tim
trueblood
10:09 PM blogger: No Tim I really do not believe that Kohl's ran Macy's out of town, any more than I think Gordman's will be responsible for Sears leaving.
That said, there is just so many department type stores that an area can handle, and we have exceeded it (but that's about to change.)
Macy's is a very high end store, and Sears is close, so naturally the shopping dollars in this town (due to demographics) will end up at the store that is less expensive (unless it's the only store.)
Crestwood Courts is dying by the second, and it need's a re-development NOW if it's to come close to surviving, not three years from now.
As you know, I greatly appreciate your nay vote on that TIF, and I firmly believe you were the ONLY ONE on that Board with the vision to see the outcome.
Well the future is here and now, and guess what, you were right all along so do we really need another TIF, TDD, CID for anything in Crestwood?
We both know the developers have sunk at least 17 Million into the project so far, and we also know they won't leave that on the table, so what say we allow them to spend their own money this time.
Well done Mr. Trueblood, and thank you for your continued service to Crestwood!
Tom Ford
Has anyone contemplated the posibility that the new owners of the mall bought it just to sell it for a profit when the market turns around? Think about it- they got the property at a fire-sale price, and have done nothing to redevelop it....nothing.
17 million in it....sit on it for a few years then turn around and sell it off for 30 milion or so?
It doesn't seem to be that much of a stretch, now does it?
If the commercial real estate rebounds somewhat, that may be a possibility.
I think Northwest Plaza was bought and then sold to another buyer a couple of years ago.
8:55AM blogger: Commercial real estate is vastly overbuilt now, so for them to develop this project it will be a stretch.
Sell it for a profit? Could be to a home developer who has a high rise in mind, but right now, that's about it.
I fear they have missed the narrow window of opportunity they had to develop the property when they bought it. Finding tenants in this economy will be a real challenge.
I pray they can pull it off, but I don't think we can count on it, so plan to be at the meeting on March 12, 2009 to tell Jim Eckrich what we must have, verses what we would like.
Tom Ford
Best we just work on keeping Kohl's parking lot full. Chances of the Plaza ever becomming a go to spot for retail seems highly unlikely. We have evolved to a bedroom community and thus would do best to keep alive what we have, improve on small business opportunities such as on Jefferson in Kirkwood and on Lockwood in Webster. The Plaza buyers knew full well the state of the economy and the fact that this is no longer a retail mecca. Granted this is no time to heavily invest in the Plaza, but common sense says if they stay with a retail concept, it will have to be very innovative. This is possible. When the economy turns the corner perhaps the new times will bring new ideas. As for Kohl's taking Macy's customers. I don't think so. Macy's(Famous) and Dillards have loyal following based on traditions from years gone by and loyal and generational customers who prefer this kind of retail; department store followers. Kohl's is conceptional shopping which appeals to the deal oriented customer and the "shopper" type. But they are a definite plus as they do add competition and new brands and options, sales galore, etc. Marshalls and TJX also add this additional dimension to shopping - choices and price, limited inventory. Target is very popular but prices are going up here and they will need to remain competitve with pricing and style. Little chance any of these will chose to locate here, as they are all over the place now. Macy's and Dillard when here had limited inventory compared to their other stores and people knew this so went elsewhere. So this property is a big question mark and in my estimation it is up to the new buyer. Unless they have guarantees of our city profiting from innovative retail and tax revenue guarantees, it does not serve us to go the TIF route. That would be egg on face. We may have to settle for housing, hotel/restaurant, office, etc and hope good things will follow. We did not twist their arm to buy the property and we do control zoning. The turnip has gone dry. We must keep our city shopper friendly and be inviting to small business. Shop local people, don't just live here. A sense of community is essential. Kirkwood has it, Webster has it, U City has it. Why not us! Do you think we can look for our "unique" button? How about a "Let's Do Crestwood" committee? A "Let's Help Stomp Out Pessimism" Gang.
The point about evolving into a bedroom community raises a question that I know has been discussed before but do not recall if it has been fully explored.
Can the city of Crestwood change its designation with the county to that of a bedroom community, rather than a point of sale city? What needs to be done to achieve this? If it can be done, are there any negative repercussions to the city or its residents?
I believe Fenton's mayor and mayor Robinson mentioned the idea, but I don't know how much research has been done thus far. Considering the declining trends in our sales tax revenues, it might be time to put more serious effort into exploring this option.
Martha Duchild
3:42 PM blogger: Now that's the sort of post were looking for here! Congratulations on a brilliant, well thought out submission!
You betcha my friend, we must blow Crestwood's horn as THE LOCATION in St. Louis county to come to for friendly shopping in stores that have the knowledgeable people to insure you leave with just what you wanted and needed!
"Times they are a changin," as the 60's song said, and if we work it right, we can be on the forefront of these changes, so what say we ALL show up on March 12, 2009 (3-4PM) and let Mr. Eckrich tell us how he plans to lead us to better times.
Thank you again for a very positive and enlightened post!
Tom Ford
4:06 PM blogger: Martha, right on the mark there! It's past time that we "opt" out of this idiot idea that sends $900+ thousand to WILD WOOD AND JENNINGS!
Jennings now has a state of the art retail plaza, and Wild Wood, well you can't buy a dog house there for less that $350,000.00 (They really need our money!)
This socialist idea by the deceased County Executive Westfall was wrong then, and it's really wrong now!
I know they have to pay Mr. Goltermans salary (he is the City Attorney there as well,) but even he is not that expensive!
So, what say you mayor Robinson, is it time to drop this ridiculous payoff to liberal socialist's? I think so!
Tom Ford
I did read somwhere that the Wildwood residents raised holy heck when the officials wanted to build a high priced new city hall. So flexing the resident muscles works.
Best we start flexing muscles, too. The more I read,the more I realize that TIF's are being seen through different lens nowdays. They have been part of this current decline where banks and developers, etc. courted us with the idea that civilization as we knew it would collapse without TIF's. Time we wise up.
Anyone ever wonder how many interesting bumps lie under the rug created by the Kohl's TIF?
TIF, CDD , CID all remind of the dark ages when the lords of the small kingdoms taxed the peasants in their little kingdoms (kohls, crestwood point etc.) and kept part for themselves and passed the rest along to kings.
According to the consitutional convention America was founded to end these tyrant kings.
2:06 PM blogger: "Bumps," well I would say they are more like mountains!
Being well connected in the political world has always been a plus to a developer, and those who would assist him, but this is amazing!
God willing the real truth as to what really happened there will be revealed sooner rather than later, but I wouldn't count on it as the second (Politically connected) statement say's it all!
Tom Ford
Does anyone know anything about the nice new "today" big sign at city hall "City of Crestwood?" I either missed the article if it was in a paper or just am not informed or in denial.
Was it free?
Who paid for it?
Surely it wasn't in the city's budget!
Did we strike gold?
6:04 PM blogger: "Today?" sign? You know it wasn't free, you know it wasn't in the budget, and no, we didn't strike gold!
Now that we have covered the basics, we need to know what it represents, and why?
Is "today" the day for resignations from Board members and "his Honor," or the day we finally wake up and make cut's?
Well, I don't know, heck I E-mailed the whole gang last Sunday to ask if I could help promote the C/A meeting, and to this second "no response!"
No response to a tax paying citizen, and I am supposed to "trust them" with more yet? You can't make this up folks, this is a hoot, or would be were it not so serious.
Tom Ford
Maybe you should tell everyone how the sign was paid for Tom? Was it part of the parking lot project which was paid for by the Kohl's TDD? Yes. Which would mean the city didn't budget it or strike gold because it was paid for with funds that could only be used for that project. The sign is very noticeable and probably raises a few eyebrows, but you should probably tell your bloggers the facts instead of using it to push your agenda.
I'm going with "agenda pushing"
3:53 PM blogger: Well, I see your Evelyn Woods speed reading course has failed you yet again!
Slow down and note that I said "I have no idea." what the sign is for!
Now if you do know, I pray you will share it with your fellow blogger's (and Me.) so we may share in your vast "POOL" of knowledge.
By the way, I do love "agenda's no matter if they are pushed, pulled, shoved, slid, or camouflaged! It's the American political way, don't you know.
Tom Ford
TOM:
Please explain how the school district "looses" with a TDD or CID? Furthermore, how do they loose with a TIF?.... But for the TIF the project would not be built and the shool district would not get any revenue.
You make some good points sometimes... but you clearly need to brush up on TDD, CID and TIF.
8:19PM blogger: Well if you look into it you will see that "tax deferred" monies, such as are normally associated with TIF, TDD, CID show less in the coffers of the school district.
Don't believe me? well I ask that you contact the Lindbergh School District finance office and have them explain it to you.
And when they do, please do not be shy about telling the rest of us what you found out.
I await their answer.
Tom Ford
Tom
Since you have "no idea", perhaps you should get the information before you start asking for resignations. As I stated, the sign was paid for with funds from the Kohl's TDD. If you would like I can give you the number to City Hall so you(in the future) can call and find out for your self. However, I am shocked that none of the Alderman have responded to you. Even the ones that you have supported faithfully. Not even a phone call. Poor Tom. Does that mean you want all eight Alderman to give their resignation? Apparently the squeakiest wheel doesn't get the most oil.
"Transportation Development District (RSMo 238.200-238.275) Transportation Development District bonds may be issued to pay for transportation improvements in a specific area which levies a special sales tax for debt retirement. A district may be used to fund, promote, plan, design, construct, improve, maintain and operate transportation projects or assist in such activity."
From the definition of terms in the Crestwood Point TDD reimbursement agreement: " 'TDD Project' means (a) demolition and reconstruction of an existing parking lot on property owned by the City." Subsection (e) of this section then throws in a laundry list of items not specified in (a) through (d).
When one thinks of traffic-related improvements, a sign for city hall does not immediately jump to mind, but because the laundry list of items in subsection (e) includes "signing", anyone interpreting this section in its broadest context could conceivably include a city hall sign as part of the parking lot improvement. A stricter interpretation of the word "signing" would limit it to actual traffic-related signs.
Obviously, the Crestwood Point TDD board went with a more liberal interpretation.
Martha Duchild
I know for a fact that the Lindbergh School District is opposed to TIF, CID, and TDD. Those tools take tax money that could be given to schools and instead puts them back in the pocket of the developer. The Lindbergh School District would not see ANY funds from tax revenue growth until the TIF, CID, or TDD is retired - which often takes 10 years or more Especially in a big, costly redevelopment like Crestwood Court.
The tax money that Lindbergh receives from a TIF business remains stagnant until the TIF is paid off, which creates a drain on school funds because the district counts on property tax revenue.
From a resolution passed by the Lindbergh school board:
In the statement, the school district lays out several guidelines that must be met for it to favor instituting another TIF:
"• The school must later receive payments it would have normally received from the "captured" property taxes.
• The length of the TIF should not exceed 10 years.
• The municipality shall implement an additional sales tax to help repay TIF bonds.
• Projects should include significant property growth.
• Old commercial properties seeking TIFs for redevelopment must demonstrate a historical reduction in assessed value — "blight."
Also, the district only will support new growth, meaning projects on existing commercial properties will not receive support."
Hmmmm....that means the school district won't support a TIF at Crestwood Court.
That Lindbergh School Board approved those guidelines a few years ago. Pat Lanane, their finance guy and also a member of the Crestwood Economic Development Commission, will stick with those demands. I guarantee it.
Let's go along with a TIF redevelopment if it hurts our schools. Let's face it. Our schools are more important than me getting my street paved or any of the cuts that are coming in Crestwood.
I'm all for helping Crestwood. But let's not hurt our schools to do it. A TIF would hurt our schools. Period. Lindbergh knows that better than anyone. That's a very well documented fact.
Give me a break! It is amazing that there are so many people here being led by false truths. Lindbergh School district shouldn't be setting any criteria for Crestwood. They get more money from our property taxes than any other entity by far. Yet they contribute no monies to the continued operation of Crestwood. If you believe they have please tell me the amount as it doesn't show up in the city budget. You say they contribute to our property values? Really? Then why don't they cough up money for those Crestwood residents who have taken a beating on the sale of their houses over the last year. They are contributing Zilch to support this city yet they get bond issue extensions, tax increases and a portion of sales taxes collected. So I ask again, how much physical money have they paid to the City of Crestwood? So why should they dictate how Crestwood deals with our biggest tax revenue generating project? If you Tom, believe the new owners of the mall are going to give you a new development with no tax assistance, well, you will be a very, very old man before you see any redevelopment of the mall. Finally, Tom if you consider yourself a supporter of this city, you had better think twice about the information you post on your blog. Make sure you know what you are talking about before you speak. Bad information can be very counterproductive to recreating our great city. Thank You
7:17,
None of Tom's information was bad. It was factual. It's a fact that the Lindbergh school district is opposed to TIF.
The issue is whether we want to deprive our schools of money just to save a few employee positions and have our streets paved? My answer is no. Schools first. City second.
At least Lindbergh has shown they can be trusted and they don't mislead voters. Prop 1, Prop S, park and stormwater tax, pick your poison in Crestwood. They've either not followed through on campaign promises or flat out didn't have a plan.
I can't afford to give more to Crestwood and Lindbergh both. Lindergh has proven to be more trustworthy, so I'll save my money and vote NO on any tax increase in Crestwood so I can vote YES the next time Lindbergh asks for one in several years.
My children's education far exceeds the needs of the city. In turn, if you have a strong school district, the city benifits by having families move here.
People don't move to citys and towns becasue of the police, public works or the dog catcher. It's based on housing stock, schools and parks.
9:04 PM blogger: "Poor Tom?" Not on your life there short round, Tom Is, was, and will remain correct on this subject!
By the way since you seem to sit at the feet of "His Honor," just what the heck is "today?"
You have a very strange method of calculating "paid for," as the 1% EXTRA SALES TAX SHOPPERS ARE PAYING AT KOHL'S PAID FOR THAT SIGN IF IT WAS PART OF THE TDD!
Tell you what, I have a bridge on Pardee Road that will surly make you a lot of money if you buy it!
Tom Ford
Hey Tom
Short round here. Don't sit at anyone's feet. Kohl's is obviously not hurt from that 1% or their costumers. Parking lot is always packed. How much money do you spend at Kohl's each year? "Today" is March 5, 2009. I'll buy the bridge and put up a toll both for a selected few, like you want to tax those in the annex. I enjoy that you only respond to a small portion of my previous blog. What about the rest? First you claim to have "no idea" and now you are "correct on the subject". When did you become informed on the subject of the sign and when do you intend to share with your readers. Or is it to difficult for you to admit when are mistaken and perhaps shouldn't be asking for across the board resignations.
Anyone want to take this bet? That stupid city sign is going to cause more accidents on Sappington from the white-hairs and soccer moms trying to read the thing.
Can you actually see around it looking south from the city parking lot?
9:12 pm BLOGGER: Welcome back "short round," and thanks as always for your post. Are we a sign commission member by chance?
I became aware of the "sign" after it was up, and doing whatever it is supposed to do, or later rather than sooner (you can't catch them all.)
Really neat isn't it, here we are flat broke, and we have a sign erected on Sappington Road to advertise meetings? Does the swim club get to advertise on it as well?
The TDD is for transportation items only, the sign doesn't move that I have seen ergo, how did we hide that in the funding?
As far as my calling for resignations, I now believe ALL OF Crestwood should do just that if the "sign" is the only item our "best and brightest" could come up with in these harrowing times!
Talk about a total waste of funding, Four forty years that I know of in the best of times we didn't need a sign to find City Hall, or advertise meetings, so why now.
I am sure you will say excess funds that had to be spent (the old use it or loose it ploy,) well ridiculous, ever hear of "banking" them for hard times (Oh wait, they are here!) Or just plain returning them to the payoff?
Thanks again for allowing me to speak out here.
Tom Ford
Not part of the sign commission. Just educated on the subject. If you are so outraged at this why didn't you complain about the lighting, landscaping, or retaining wall which have been there for months. Ergo your logic is incorrect or should I say not the "best and brightest." They don't move either so did you just not want your readers to think you are insane.
TDD & CID involve additonal taxes that have nothing to do with the school district. Call Pat and ask him if Lindbergh would support a new business locating in the district that just used a CID or TDD.... I bet you my next paycheck he says yes.
For some strange reason I think the brand new super dooper super size sign at city hall is tacky sorta like a sign for a fast food place, bank or church. For all these years, I have found our city hall plenty asthetic and totally satisfactory in its simplicity. Where is it written we have to spend money just to spend money because it is available. Hello there,is not the whole nation, not to mention this city, economically stressed due to excess? Guess Crestwood wants to remain part of this.
Get a grip Crestwood.
No way will I will ever vote yes on a tax increase until such nonsense stops. What is it about fiscal responsibility (all tax money local, national, etc) that this city and its last 4 city administrators and the illustrious BOA's don't get???
Post a Comment
<< Home