To increase tax's or not to increase tax's, that is the question! Whether is is nobler to live within our means, or tax and spend?
Sorry about that "Bard," but it's early, and all I could think of at zero dark thirty!
I thought having a thread all to itself reference taxes here in Crestwood would be more than interesting. If your for, or against mattes not to me, but I do wish to see concise facts, no emotion, and exactly what YOUR plan would be to alleviate the "strain" that some on the Board seem to think is mandatory.
We all know about raises for employees, new vehicles, excessive salaries, and "duplicate positions" by now so please let's come up with a viable reason for or against the 10th tax increase in 12 years!
In closing let me ask that you not attempt to belittle your fellow Crestwoodians, but rather attack this from the standpoint of a business that is going through hard times and needs restructuring to stay viable.
Your turn lease.
Tom Ford
NO. 1015
I thought having a thread all to itself reference taxes here in Crestwood would be more than interesting. If your for, or against mattes not to me, but I do wish to see concise facts, no emotion, and exactly what YOUR plan would be to alleviate the "strain" that some on the Board seem to think is mandatory.
We all know about raises for employees, new vehicles, excessive salaries, and "duplicate positions" by now so please let's come up with a viable reason for or against the 10th tax increase in 12 years!
In closing let me ask that you not attempt to belittle your fellow Crestwoodians, but rather attack this from the standpoint of a business that is going through hard times and needs restructuring to stay viable.
Your turn lease.
Tom Ford
NO. 1015
posted by Crestwood Independent at 05:50
29 Comments:
If the people believe everything that can be done has been done to control spending (lots of doubt here) by having an independant audit.. It might be possible to increase taxes if (big if) still required.
If it was on the ballot it might get more than aldermanic immediate family members going to the polls to voice there opinion...something the present regime might not want...(pitchfork theory).
An audit does not provide justification for the business model.
An audit simply verifies the money was spent at the places the books indicate.
An Audit adresses sacred cows...and leads to questions being asked. Maybe a public forum is in order...with all the department heads present...(that will never happen)
But remember - there are those who will vote for a tax increase; but first we gotta streamline the staff with employee cuts. And those in charge of employee cuts have to pick the same employees that are blog approved. Otherwise - No Go! How do we know who to cut? Blogger know best - I guess!
Streamline staff and make some major changes to services, starting with contracting St. Louis County for police services.
I guess my question is...why is that the question? Has a tax increase been proposed? Is one forcoming on a ballot? I have heard nothing of the kind. The city has nearly a million dollar surplus, there has been no public statement about a tax increase, and it appears we are holding our own as a city. Why the debate? Just to see who can get the maddest?
11:23 am Excuse me If I ask..... Who are you to say which people get cut (you say streamline staff)? Also who are you and what powerful position in Crestwood do you hold to say to eliminate our police department and go County? Further, are you saying that if these things are done, you will vote for a tax? Do you have a background in city management, or are you a personnel analyst, or have the knowledge of Crestwood's personnel so much so that you have the answers? OR are you just giving the city an ultimatum holding these stipulations hostage stating - "I won't vote for your tax increase unless the above is followed? Further, if you have all of this vast knowledge or manna from the Holy Spirit where have you been? We have been looking for you for so long. Why didn't you come forward back when we started having all these problems. Do you know how long we have been praying for someone like you? Wow, it must be great to be so all knowing.
Sandy G,
In regard to my 11:23a comment of contracting with County for police, thank you for cutting me down to size. It appears you not only take issue with my "plan," but also with following the moderator's request of not belittling your fellow residents.
Sandy G.,
Just because you sign your name to your posts does not make it ok for you to belittle other anon posters. Please speak to others how you would like to be spoken to.
12:17 PM Blogger: The "why" is because at the last BOA meeting "fresh ideas" were put forth such as Town Hall meetings, and Ward meetings to regain the voters confidence.
Now this is not being put out there because a group of sinners want to repent, oh no my friend the idea behind that sort of thing is raising the rent, pure and simple.
I like the idea of the meetings very much and I will attend when they come around, but I am to old a bunny to buy a "Quick Persian rug," Ergo the question.
Tom Ford
Be careful. Sandy may become angry.
Sandy I happen to agree with the posters.
I would also like to add this.
4 years ago the individual department managers gave after hours presentations to the public regarding the costs for services rendered. The peak attendance was 50.
Not a very good attendance.
To ALL the detractors of Sandy, Sandy herself, and ALL the people who think this is their fifteen minutes of fame on the comedy club hour, I ask that you settle down, and cease and desist with the smart remarks.
All any of us here want to see is your thoughts on a tax increase, the need for a tax increase, or the "lust" for a tax increase. Also, if you please give us your reasoning, and what YOU would do to make your case a viable one, simple, no?
Tom Ford
Dear Anonymous - I am so sorry and I do apologize for my comments as I should know better. I wasn't trying to belittle you or get upset with you - as much as I showed my frustration about some of the things I read on this blog. For instance, I get upset with persons who are so willing to speak about eliminating this job or that job and this person or that person when they are not qualified to say who goes and go stays! Some bloggers feel they know exactly who to cut and who not to cut. And I say based on what? Their great knowledge? Or who they talk to that doesn't like that person and wants them cut. They base this on nothing more than what they are told by others. It makes me get upset and then I get ugly and I am truly sorry. And 3:44 I should treat others how I would like to be treated. I just get angry at people who spread gossip and heresay about city personnel. There is a lot of that at City Hall and I hate all of it. It's just plain wrong. It is up to those in charge to do something or nothing about personnel. Yet people say if certain jobs/persons/positions are not cut, they will not vote for a tax increase. Sorry but I think that is wrong. We need to save money and we need to be frugal but it isn't up to us to say who goes and who stays. People love to point fingers, and people love to talk. But I for one hope and pray that this mayor and our board of aldermen as well as the temporary city administrator, whom I have known for years and admire very much, can make some critical decisions on what to do. Other than that - if a tax increase is put on the ballot, I will vote for it and there will be no caviats from me or strings attached to my decision. Again, please forgive me for being such an idiot because I really got upset and spoke rudely. I hope nobody looses their jobs and I hope that we keep our police and fire plus all our good people. I feel that it is not right to cut people based on nothing more that who is liked and who isn't.
Thanks you for your consideration.
i agree with Sandy. I am very much opposed to anyone being fired.
The average attendance at the BOA is 15 or less ..not all of them residents...if you subtract the Officer Kuhn contingent it drops to 12.there are more officials than residents there.What does that say? .
It tells me they are payed to be there.
Sandy
I agree with the fact that we are not necessarily qualified to decide what jobs are eliminated.
The voters however can and do send message of confidence in the government leaders when they vote yes or no on a tax increase proposal.
The message was loud and clear the last time. No confidence or trust. The reasons are wide and varied but the message is still clear. I believe that same message would be sent again since the information from city hall is still contradictory. The last city Administrator certainly did more harm than good regarding accurate trust building information.
Thank god for some citizens, the civil service board, and the BOA. Another test demonstrating the structure of the charter is well constructed.
The ways and means committee is for the first in 10 plus years performing its duty. Let's observe what they decide during the next few months.
9:05 -Thanks for your nice input and again I am sorry for being too harsh and not very respectful at times. I have faith in our new mayor, aldermen and those persons in our city offices who work hard to keep things in perspective. There are not very many people left that I know at city hall, but I feel that we should not be a divided city, and need to stand together to get things accomplished. I am happy that we have a good Ways and Means Committee and I will observe and respect what they decide to do budget-wise. And as long as what goes on at city hall is done fairly without mayhem and foolishness, I will support the decisions that are made. I will be the first to admit that I am very bad about attending board meetings. But I still vote and try to pick the right people to represent me in Ward 2. I will always vote on every issue that is on the ballot. So, we need to stick together and get things done so everyone is happy again - like it use to be. That is my fondest wish. Thank you.
Sandy, I am very glad you have faith in the mayor. I do not. I feel he is a part time mayor who made statements while campaigning he knew very well he couldn't follow through on. And, lo and behold, no follow through! He made it sound as though all he needed to do was make a few calls and the mall would be up and running in no time. Said it was a first priority. That's all people heard...they apparently didn't stop to think that the mayor has no control over the people who own the mall.
11:00 I am really sorry to hear that you have no faith in the mayor. Outside of Pat Killoren, I am not sure if we ever had a full-time mayor. I knew that Jeff Schlink is part-time but what I was hoping for was a city administrator who could administrate and take care of the day-to-day operations. I also was hoping that Jeff would be working with the CA to achieve the goals by making Crestwood go forward with some type of plan for our future.
I do not go to meetings to see first hand if progress is being made but if no is the answer, I am really disappointed. I know that there is little to no audience at the board meetings which is really not good. I don't know all the reasons why there is no attendance except for my own negligance. But I am 70 and there are a lot of young people who should be taking charge, and taking control.
Further, the young people and residents feel that we septaginarians are making out our Last Will and Testament and have no brain tissue left - HA! And many times they are correct!
I can remember many who on this blog voiced over and over again the mishaps of Roy Robinson and his failures as mayor. I just have to wonder why there have been NO - NADDA judgements and condemnations regarding Jeff, if what you say is true. All I heard were slams and bad words about Roy! Why there has been nothing said about this mayor - I do not know and further I am sticking my neck out even mentioning it. That's how much bloggers hated Roy and I thought I would never hear the end of how bad of a mayor he was. Every other comment screamed with disgust. But not so with this mayor.
I do know that the mall days are over with. And since it was the first one to be built, I guess it is why it was the first one to go. We all loved it - my daughter and her friends loved it - I would put her in her stroller and walk to the mall on a nice summer evening.
But maybe optimism was in everybody's head at the time Jeff was campaigning - I don't know! However, we need to get our governing body's attention that we need leaders who will work hard and I hope and pray that we get a good city administrator to assist them because that person is of utmost importance to our future. Karl Kestler is acting CA now and he would be wonderful if we could keep him in that seat. Karl knows this city and is honest, fair, and has good sense. But that seat is one of the most important in helping and assisting the mayor. He/she will be at city hall every day and one of their main duties is to keep the mayor and aldermen updated.
You have no idea how many times I had to call the aldermen (Tim Trueblood knows) at work explaining issues and calling meetings, or getting a yes or no answer from them. It was exciting, it was fun and I felt I was doing something important to help the CA.
The mayor and board all have full-time jobs or almost all of them. If you don't learn communication skills and how important they are - you will never, ever make it in the city administration business.
Thank you because I appreciate your comments very much.
"I feel he is a part time mayor who made statements while campaigning he knew very well he couldn't follow through on. And, lo and behold, no follow through! He made it sound as though all he needed to do was make a few calls and the mall would be up and running in no time." 11:00AM April 18
Could you please reference when and where Jeff Schlink said he would have the mall up and running in no time?
Your lucky if he returns a phone call....They all need to attend City Charter 101 again.
"Who are you to say which people get cut (you say streamline staff)? Also who are you and what powerful position in Crestwood do you hold to say to eliminate our police department and go County? Further, are you saying that if these things are done, you will vote for a tax? Do you have a background in city management, or are you a personnel analyst, or have the knowledge of Crestwood's personnel so much so that you have the answers? OR are you just giving the city an ultimatum holding these stipulations hostage stating - "I won't vote for your tax increase unless the above is followed?"
Sandy...who am I?
I'm a voter.
I pay taxes.
And if I don't want to pay an additional tax for my own reasons, so be it. That's how the system works. It's supposedly a free country where voters can choose for their own reasons to vote for or against something. If you and the great government of the City of Crestwood think that we the people should not have that say, then perhaps you should start a revolution to a more-controlling form of government where the people do not have a say.
11:18 AM Blogger: I paid quite a bit of attention to Mr. Schlink,s comment' during the race, and I NEVER heard him say he had any influence over the Court's owners in Chicago.
I fear you mistook his willingness to meet with them and call them for a promise to have them do something.
Remember we do not own one square yard of that property, so when and if the spirit moves the owner we shall see what comes of it.
Now there is one way to "inspire" the owner that being serve them with a court summons for "blighted property" and then maybe the process may be moved along a bit faster.
Do we really want to do that? I doubt it, so just hold your horses.
Tom Ford
2:35 April 18 - Where did I tell you in my comments that you don't have the right to vote against a tax increase????.
You and whoever else wants to say NO to a tax increase - that is your right! I just won't be one of them. You are reading things into my comments! This is still a free country last I heard - so say NO if you are so inclined. And when the votes are counted - the people will have spoken, one way or the other.
Crestwood is a point-of-sale city and we make our money from retail sales. Now the Mall is gone and for years we had retail sales tax coming in all the time. You say no new taxes while everybody else raises their's, including the Lindbergh School District.
If you think by cutting jobs and people is enough to get us out of our problems - that's your opinion, not mine. If we are not stepping up and improve a situation - we are going backwards because "time goes forward". If we don't move with time - we loose! I don't get you, and you don't get me. Thank you for your comment anyway!
Sandy,
You asked "Who are you to say..." and all I said was that I am a voter and a resident and if I want to vote against a tax increase, that is my right. No, I'm not a city analyst, consultant, or manager. And the fact that I am not does not make me any better or worse than anyone else.
If you think throwing money at city hall and keeping or adding staff will move us forward, well good for you.
I pay high utility taxes because I live here. I pay high sales taxes when I shop in Crestwood. If you don't believe me, check the tax rates for municipalities throughout St. Louis County. The ONLY cheap tax rate for Crestwood is our real estate taxes. If Foote and the others have their way, our real estate taxes will increase.
I've lived in St. Louis City. I've lived in unincorporated St. Louis County. I've lived in out state Missouri. Fortunately, everywhere I lived, I have had excellent services. But I'm damn sick and tired of getting beat over the head about our real estate taxes and how "lucky" I am. Horse hockey. I've seen the drive-in fiasco. I saw the anti-business sentiment on the board from years ago. I saw the police station mess. And then I'm told how lucky I am to live here and that I should be ashamed that I don't pay more taxes.
Don't property taxes drop when your house is assessed at a lower value? If crestwood is going 'down the tubes ' won't it be reflected in its house prices..? and the ammount of property taxes collected?
Older residents leave due to illness or death. Their children then rent the propeties..Propeties not maintained and renters not properly screened...all lead to trouble...and lowering of neighborhoods value.
More words of wisdom from my REO friend (and retired Marine Aviator,) "GOO."
my liberal neighbors aren't speaking to me.
I recently asked my neighbors’ little girl what she wanted to be when she grows up. She said she wanted to be President some day. Both of her parents, are liberal Democrats, were standing there, so I asked her, ‘If you were President what would be the first thing you would do?’
She replied, ‘I’d give food and houses to all the homeless people.’
Her parents beamed with pride.
’Wow…what a worthy goal.’ I told her, ‘But you don’t have to wait until you’re President to do that! You can come over to my house and mow the lawn, pull weeds, and sweep my yard, and I’ll pay you $50. Then I’ll take you over to the grocery store where the homeless guy hangs out, and you can give him the $50 to use toward food and a new house.‘
She thought that over for a few seconds, then she looked me straight in the eye and asked, ’ Why doesn't the homeless guy come over and do the work, and you can just pay him the $50? ‘
I said, ‘Welcome to Conservatism.’
Her parents still aren't speaking to me.
Tom Ford
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