Interesting letter to the South County Times by a Cresatwood citizen.
Read more: http://www.southcountytimes.com/Site.
Letters.html#ixzz2KLotbQVS
"Cities Should Welcome New Retail With Open Arms"
"Martha Duchild (Crestwood alderwoman) and Forrest Miller (banquet operator), both residents of Crestwood, have injected themselves into the Shrewsbury Walmart matter with their letters of Feb. 1.
Shrewsbury's vacant business property problem pales in comparison with the huge white elephant formerly known as Crestwood Plaza.
Mr. Miller tells us Walmart kills off businesses and therefore they should not receive assistance. I would suggest the poor economy is causing more closings than Walmart locating somewhere. An example: the Baker Shoes bankruptcy and total closings of hundreds of shoe stores. Drive around and there are vacant store spaces everywhere. Did Walmart kill off all those businesses ... really?
Anyone - I repeat, anyone - who is interested in opening some retail business should be welcomed with open arms and afforded help to locate in vacant spaces.
This is no time to get picky or lay down barriers, or you can expect to be left holding the bag while other areas offer better deals. You don't want Walmart, fine. But then who else is knocking at your door ... no one?"
Bill Keller
Crestwood
February 06, 2013
I am not sure where to go with this one folks, first Mr. Keller gets it wrong (he lives here remember,) when he states that Mrs. Duchild is a Crestwood Alderman (her husband is.) Next he launches into what he claims is the fact that She and Mr. Miller have "injected themselves" into the Shrewsbury Walmart proposal (they haven't.)
When last I looked this is still America where one has the right to comment on what they wish (he certainly has, no?) That said I see no reason to tell the letter writers that they have no dog in the fight. Mr. Keller, please note that I nor anyone else have told you that you shouldn't comment, and I think you owe that same courtesy to Mrs. Duchild and Mr. Miller.
By the way, are you going to drive down there and pay the increased taxes it will take to fund this project? The community wonders.
Tom Ford
NO. 1089
posted by Crestwood Independent at 17:23
33 Comments:
He doesn't address the main issue at hand - economic assistance. How far do we go with TIF, TDD, CID, etc?
I agree with his basic premise - welcome business with open arms - but I'll add that I don't necessarily want to welcome businesses with the city's open wallet.
If economic assistance is requested, the developer should provide a solid plan with tenants who have signed on the dotted line.
1:37 AM Blogger: Yes indeed my friend, who wouldn't want a new business, unless it's a smut dealer. or worse.
What he is missing (among other things) is the fact that if a business is viable, vibrant, and the right fit, they don't need tax subsidies!
In case you haven't noticed were doing OK (not great but OK) with NO PLAZA. Would it be great to have one? Yes, but at whose expense?
I for one am tired of giving the farm keys to a developer who "can't do it by themselves" at the expense of the school district, the extra tax for up to 2o some years, and all the rest of the fluff that goes with it/.
If it's so good, build it on your own or stay home!
Tom Ford
Obviously everyone is free to express their opinions as citizens, and healthy debates are a good thing.
As for the comments, the tax subsidies for the Shrewsbury development are different than the ones proposed for Crestwood Court. The Shrewsbury development is uninspired big box retail. Also, the Affton School District formally opposed the development. In Crestwood, the development is more unique. Also, Lindbergh has not opposed the use of TIF financing for the project (and they have the most to lose). Lindbergh hasn't endorsed the plan yet either, but I think they realize that some assistance is necessary to redevelop that site.
If the mall site was just empty land, I don't think the developer would need subsidies, and there probably would be plenty of businesses happy to build there. However, it will take a lot of money to knock down the outdated mall and parking garage, and then turn around and build new structures. If the project is even a moderate success, the city and school district stand to make a killing. This kind of public/private partnership mutually benefits the whole area, and is an appropriate use of tax increment financing.
Finally, I don't know if Crestwood is doing OK without the sales taxes from that area. The general fund is projected to run almost a $200,000 deficit this year: http://www.ci.crestwood.mo.us/pdf/Ways%20and%20Means%202013%20Budget%20Draft-DRAFT.pdf
Almost 45% of the general revenue comes from sales taxes. If that site is redeveloped, the additional sales taxes should be enough to bring the budget into balance, without looking to the homeowners for more property taxes. If the site continues to sit vacant, then you have to look to the homeowners and more property taxes.
I for one would like to continue to enjoy low property taxes, and have people from outside Crestwood help subsidize our city services by shopping in the city and paying sales taxes. Currently, it is not a coincidence that we have the lowest property tax in St. Louis County of any municipality with its own fire department (with the exception of Des Peres). It is also not a coincidence that Des Peres redeveloped West County Mall with TIF, and subsidizes its services with sales taxes raised at the mall from people all over St. Louis County.
Here is a list of the St. Louis County municipalities with their own fire departments:
http://www.stlouisco.com/YourGovernment/OtherGovernmentAgencies/CountyFireDistricts
And here are their property tax rates:
http://revenue.stlouisco.com/collection/2011/2011RateBook.pdf
10:51 AM Blogger: Thank you for the information, I appreciate your looking all this up for us. However, meanwhile back in Crestwood, we have what we have.
Any developer with any sense knows that the "mall" is full of asbestos that must be abated. and then the cost of hauling out the remainder of the trash once known as "where the big stores are."
We have an elephant in the living room that is not going away soon so we have to play the cards we have.
Remember the kids story, "all the Kings horses, and all the Kings men?"
Tom Ford
In April, voters in Crestwood will be able to pick in 3 of our 4 Wards, new Aldermen.
Wouldn't the TIF question be a good one to ask each person running in an open forum before the election?
I know due to the efforts of Tom Ford, Ward Two will have this for it's voters. What about the Ward 3 and 4? Don't those voters want a chance to ask those running to represent you this question, face to face? Who will step up to the plate and take the reins to do the same from those Wards?
"Almost 45% of the general revenue comes from sales taxes. If that site is redeveloped, the additional sales taxes should be enough to bring the budget into balance, without looking to the homeowners for more property taxes. If the site continues to sit vacant, then you have to look to the homeowners and more property taxes."
It should be mentioned that Crestwood has a high sales tax rate and has high utility taxes.
I agree with you that Crestwood is a bargain - to a point.
I respectfully ask, the developer's current plan -
a bowling alley,
Grocery Store,
Movie theater,
means the site will be redeveloped?
I think his current plan is weak at best. Yes, some sort of economic assistance may be needed. In today's world of warring municipalities and the runaway use of TIF, Crestwood is probably stuck using it. But I have yet to see a strong or sustainable plan from this developer. Ultimately, this development will take careful negotiation on the part of the city.
there were words about a Walmart grocery being brought in. Given that there's one a mile or so down the road, and 3 other grocery store within spitting diatance, that would be a very bad idea unless it's an unusual like a Trader Joe's or Whole Foods. Wal Mary grocery would be seriously bad planning for that location.
http://dor.mo.gov/pdf/rates/2013/jan2013.pdf
I don't think Crestwood sales taxes are especially high when compared to our neighbors. Most south county/mid county municipalities are also 8 to 8.5% (Kirkwood, Sunset Hills, Webster Groves, Glendale, Rock Hill, Shrewsbury, Brentwood, Maplewood). Some of Fenton is 7.4%, but Gravois Bluffs is the same as Crestwood at 8.4%. Unincorporated South County is the lowest in the area at just under 7%. I'm not sure how Crestwood compares with respect to utility rates, but I know Webster and Kirkwood both charge them. I don't think Sunset Hills does.
As for the tenant mix in the development, I think some of that remains to be seen. As to what has been announced, I think a Whole Foods or Trader Joes would certainly work as the grocery store, and would be a destination for much of South County. If it is another grocery store (such as Walmart), that is is problematic--completely agree with the other posters on that point. Everyone is down on the bowling alley because of Crestwood Bowl, but my understanding of the concept is something more akin to Pin Up Bowl (http://www.pinupbowl.com/) or Flamingo Bowl (http://www.flamingobowl.net/) as opposed to a traditional bowling alley, and would attract a different demographic. As for the movie theater, I think a new multiplex could do well there servicing the Crestwood/Webster/Kirkwood/Affton areas.
8:54 PM Blogger: Whole foods will not come to Crestwood as long as local 888 is able to tell the TIF board they must allow a vote to go union.
Notice that they pulled out of the big project in St. Louis because of that very same thing, so why come here for more?
What we have here is simply a chicken / egg thing. The developer needs signed prospectus's from the leaders (they have none,) and the City needs a viable developer (we have none.) so on it will go.
The idiot's at there EPA will toss a major wrench into any idea that is a complete tear down of the Court's as there is a major amount of asbestos there along with, ? The cost of compliance alone will fend off most developers, and I see it only getting worse under obama.
So now what do we do? A new City park, an aquatic adventure park. or flood it and put in a gambling boat (I will run it for 2% of the take.)
All joking aside folks, were LAND LOCKED, the population has moved west, gas is $3.45 a gallon, and were left with the prospect of a combo residential / small specialty shop concept at best, so let's admit it and get this going.
Tom Ford
Ladies and gentlemen,:
It is time to realize that centrum properties has used the remaining portion of the property revenue generation. The property value will have to be established again, most likely at a considerable discount to 17 million already paid. Until this is accomplished no one can afford to renovate the area. I for one do not support artificial support aka tax payer money to accomplish the discount. Let market force drive the value.
I will/do not support aldermen who give tax payer money to a for profit business and then ask the taxpayers for a tax increase to support the government. I would expect a significant amount of other people are asking how of my hard earned money do I keep?
At the present pace the government will run out of other people's money in very few years. Then what?
That was a fiasco in the CWE with Whole Foods. Maybe Trader Joe's is still an option? I think they are owned by the same company that operates Aldi's, but obviously serve different markets.
On a different note, while it is always sad to see businesses close (especially local businesses), I bet the 3 current Crestwood grocery stores stand to get a little more business with the closure of Sappington Farmers' Market and Johnny's.
11:08 AM Blogger: I hope they did (Freddie's Market did,) we are not interested in ANYTHING going outside Crestwood, are we.
Still, another food store or for that matter a bowling alley is a bit much, no?
Tom Ford
FYI to all Ward Two residents: Ms. Jackie Stock and I will host a "meet and greet" the candidates on March 26, 2013 from six PM to seven PM. in the BOA chambers.
We urge you to come out to meet the two fine candidates for Alderman in the April race, and then stay for the Alderman meeting.
More to come later.
Jackie Stock
Tom Ford
It will be intersting to see if the new city administrator will be a voice of fresh air..or will he nod his head sagely at the the BOA meetings and wait out his retirement in a low profile AKA (safe mode).
Will he ruffle feathers ? attack sacred cows?..tread on toes?? At least he doesn't have the mysoginist factor working against him like the last one seemed to.I wish him ( and Crestwood) well.. but I'm not holding my breath...
6:40 AM Blogger: You do realize that he is a retired Air Force Colonel, right?
Nuff said, trust me.
Ton Ford
no offense, but being a retired Air Force Col. doesn't make him good at this job OR a decent person. It is possible to have been in the military and not be good at every job on the planet.
Dr. Phil might have been a better choice.
7:39 AM Blogger: "No offence" but do you know this man?
I really doubt it.
Tom Ford
1;28 PM Blogger: You do realize that if you live in Crestwood, your part of the "problem," right?
Still want Dr. Phil
Tom Ford
Dr Phil couldn't afford the pay cut.
no, I do not know this man. I assume that you do, and that is wonderful. You made a statement that said because he was retired Air Force that that should be all the reference he would ever need.I believe your words were "'nuff said". I simply pointed out that being retired from the military isn't a guarantee of being good at this job. No need to get your knickers in a twist.
9:58 PM Blogger: Rising to the rank of Col. in any of the armed forces you can be certain he / she is the right person for the job.
Tom Ford
Whatever you say. I hope you're right.
I plant to take a break from this and watch the SOTU address tonight. I understand Ted Nugent has been invited. This has the potential to one of the most hilarious outcomes in history. If it weren't so disrepectful to a sitting president I'd be laughing out loud.
Change will be minimal...you don't get to be a Colonel by arguing with your superiors who gave you a 95k a year job and 4 weeks vacation..
12:48 PMK Blogger: I hope Ted will just stare him down! What will be interesting is how often the so called media pans to Ted while "liar one" is speaking.
We are not disrespecting the office of the President, we are disrespecting a man who is an abject liar, and a communist!
The Office and trappings are in tact, he is not.
Tom Ford
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
"We" are not disrespecting the office? You will be there?
Listen, this isn't the motor city but some of you seem to have gotten worked up into some cat-scratch fever. So undo your stranglehold and chill.
If you've never listened to Ted Nugent, none of this will make sense to you. Then again, it still might not make any sense. My wife says I never make any sense anyway. Good night.
7:10 PM Blogger: REALLY? SINCE THE INCEPTION OF THIS BLOG IN 2006 THERE HAS BEEN A RULE THAT IF YOU INSULT SOMEONE, ANYONE, YOU SIGN YOUT NAME!
Your history liberal, IF you come back do it right, or don't do it at all!
TOM FORD
___ ____
well, I looked some of the claims in the deleted post up:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/nugent.asp
The claims are suspiscious, because he recants his own words later, then claims to have used drugs to get out of the draft. The man changes his story just often enough to make the truth unattainable. The pattern is of a draft dodger, yes, but there is little proof aside from his own words, and those change regularly. You be the judge.
So, any opinion rendered?
As to what has been announced, I think a Whole Foods or Trader Joes would certainly work as the grocery store, and would be a destination for much of South County. If it is another grocery store (such as Walmart), that is is problematic--completely agree with the other posters on that point. Everyone is down on the bowling alley because of Crestwood Bowl, but my understanding of the concept is something more akin to Pin Up Bowl (http://www.pinupbowl.com/) or Flamingo Bowl (http://www.flamingobowl.net/) as opposed to a traditional bowling alley, and would attract a different demographic. As for the movie theater, I think a new multiplex could do well there servicing the Crestwood/Webster/Kirkwood/Affton areas.
Yes I agree. And the moon is made of cheese and Jimmy Hoffa and Elvis are going to shovel snow in Crestwood tomorrow.
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